Rumors of a Honda Supersport apparently false

[charismaticmegafauna]

But personally, I am still not in the market for an auto-shifting bike yet. The added complexity is just not worth the benefit, IMO Maybe in another 20 years when I can't pull in the clutch lever anymore.

I don't think the progress in technology (auto-shift) has anything/much to do with rider physical infirmities?

It's about the realities of present/future automotive/motorcycle design -- people just don't (figuratively) shift manual transmission gears anymore.

(just as they don't hand-crank/kick-start... )

 

[SockMonkey]

So shaft drive notwithstanding, what will this Super Tenere do that my VStrom 1000 won't?

Really go off road. If it's really 400 lbs dry, and 1200cc, some Jesse bags and lights and it could be pretty entertaining and capable.

Hopefully Honda will have a VFR at the bike show that we can touch / sit on. If it's a center piece on a turnstyle that would a bummer.

No kidding. That was the worst mistake Kawi made with the C-14. Stupid turntable and no sit on bike. IOW, not ready for prime time. Don't hold your breath though. I'm personally thinking we'll get hosed on a IMS VFR. Just take a nice shot of some empty carpet space in the Honda area.

Where do people keep coming up with this 400lb number (or are we getting punked..)? :blink: If the 660 Tenere is 454lbs (206kgs) wet, unless the 1200 Super is made out of Titanium I can assure you it's going to come in at least as porcine as a 1200 GS (@ 504lbs/229kgs wet).

EDIT: Sorry, I read back a few posts and saw where beemerdons had pulled that number (440lbs/200kgs) from a French site (never trust the frogs...). But seriously, that weight just doesn't pass the basic sniff test for a 1200cc bike; particularly a bike with shaft drive. Even the parallel twin, chain drive 800 GS is 455lbs/207kgs wet.

 

[Fred W]

But personally, I am still not in the market for an auto-shifting bike yet. The added complexity is just not worth the benefit, IMO Maybe in another 20 years when I can't pull in the clutch lever anymore.

I don't think the progress in technology (auto-shift) has anything/much to do with rider physical infirmities?

It's about the realities of present/future automotive/motorcycle design -- people just don't (figuratively) shift manual transmission gears anymore.

(just as they don't hand-crank/kick-start... )

Well... this people does.

 

[user 213]

If the 660 Tenere is 454lbs (206kgs) wet, unless the 1200 Super is made out of Titanium I can assure you it's going to come in at least as porcine as a 1200 GS (@ 504lbs/229kgs wet).
EDIT: Sorry, I read back a few posts and saw where beemerdons had pulled that number (440lbs/200kgs) from a French site (never trust the frogs...). But seriously, that weight just doesn't pass the basic sniff test for a 1200cc bike; particularly a bike with shaft drive. Even the parallel twin, chain drive 800 GS is 455lbs/207kgs wet.

SockMonkey - The 2010 660 Tenere is 206 Kg WET and has a steel frame, and a 23 liter fuel tank. Link

The Super Tenere otoh, the parallel twin won't add that much weight over the 660 single. The 200 Kg dry weight wouldn't be hard to make. Still, that is comparing wet to dry. Wet weight would probably add close to 50 lbs. That would put it in the 800GS territory with more power and shaft drive. Note that the F800GS specs 207 kgs wet with it's parallel twin motor and chain drive, though it's dry weight is 178 kgs. Makes me wonder if they will try an aluminum frame on the Super Tenere instead of the classic steel? And if that would be good or bad, longevity wise?

 

[SockMonkey]

Updated review from Motorcycle USA: 2010 Honda VFR1200F First Ride

I think it's apparent that the moto press is suitably impressed with this bike, with a growing consensus that Honda got this one right...

 

[RadioHowie]

So, IS there gonna be a VFR1200-based ST bike? The articles I've read already compare it to an ST rather than a sport bike, and if you add the panniers and tail box, Instant ST. Why would, and will, Honda build an ST version since it basically already is one?

 

[SkooterG]

Updated review from Motorcycle USA: 2010 Honda VFR1200F First Ride
I think it's apparent that the moto press is suitably impressed with this bike, with a growing consensus that Honda got this one right...

What brand new, just introduced model is the press NOT enamored with?

 

[SockMonkey]

So, IS there gonna be a VFR1200-based ST bike? The articles I've read already compare it to an ST rather than a sport bike, and if you add the panniers and tail box, Instant ST. Why would, and will, Honda build an ST version since it basically already is one?

I ask the same question... I can't see that "upsizing" this platform to an ST or FJR class bike makes much sense. This may well wind up being their ST replacement, with a line-up looking like this: NT700V, VFR1200F, Gold Wing. (As an aside, who wants to start placing bets that the VFR1200F will come in at around $20k in full touring trim (including DCT, side & top cases, heated grips, etc.?)

 

[mmonroe]

So, IS there gonna be a VFR1200-based ST bike? The articles I've read already compare it to an ST rather than a sport bike, and if you add the panniers and tail box, Instant ST. Why would, and will, Honda build an ST version since it basically already is one?

To me, it is starting to look like that there is a single VFR1200F that can be had with two transmissions - standard and autoshift. There is a factory option of hard luggage and whatnot. As best I can tell - that is the bike people.

Personally, I am liking it. I want to see what it weighs with the factory hard luggage, however, I am digging the power and the sporting nature of the bike. I suspect it will be very smooth both from an engine perspective and throttle.

 

[beemerdons]

Updated review from Motorcycle USA: 2010 Honda VFR1200F First Ride
I think it's apparent that the moto press is suitably impressed with this bike, with a growing consensus that Honda got this one right...

What brand new, just introduced model is the press NOT enamored with?

https://piston-ported.netfirms.com/mcss.html Vespa 180 Super Sport didn't get a good review in 1965 Scootering Magazine!!!

 

[user 213]

For now the ST is dead. You don't kill a bike off w/o a replacement that model year. It sort of looks like Honda is trying to do what the auto industry has been doing for years, use one base platform for multiple vehicles. A lot harder on a bike.

As to the press, they are paid to blather on about every new offering. Nothing they say means anything to me. When I can actually see it, sit on it and ride it, then the truth comes out. Each of us has to find that out for ourselves. I might love it, Fred might hate it, who knows until it's real and here?

The V-4 has a rep for smoothness. It remains to be seen what Honda's new system will feel like when it shuts down two cylinders. The V-tec VFR didn't go over too well, IIRC. I can't help but wonder if this will be yet another bike that looks good on paper, but has too many new things to go wrong and doesn't ride as well as the predecessor. The C-14 has a great, smooth engine too, but it's not selling that well. Kipass, heat, cramped riding position. I guess we will see eventually how well Honda handles their issues, if the bike comes to us. And Sock, don't argue that until you have a picture of you sitting on one in Seattle or your local dealer.

 

[SkooterG]

Interesting that is only 23 lbs. lighter (wet weight) than a 2003 FJR. 612 lbs vs 635 lbs. VFR has become a porker.

I predict it's DCT will be as popular as the FJR's AE (as in not very). Even if it is a better system, most peeps still want to shift themselves.

 

[jimefjr]

Looks like a BMW to me...did Honda buy BMW or did BMW buy out Honda? GROSS!

 

[Fred W]

Well, you may think the current BMW models and this new bike are gross, and I might be inclined to agree wit' ya :thumbsup: , but they do sell a good number of those Bavarian albatrosses 'round these parts. And some folks think they look great! There is just no accounting for subjective tastes. I mean, Hells Bells, I just found out this weekend that the best selling beer in the USA is Butt Light!! :blink:

However, I don't think this is the end of the game yet for Honda. Earlier reports indicated that the ST13 replacement was not due out until NEXT year, as in the next model release cycle year, not 2010. I'm inclined to believe that they will be coming up with a completely different packaging of the VFR 1200 engine to replace the ST1300. In the meantime, they will continue to sell off the '09 ST13s they have in back stock.

I'm sure that even Honda realizes that this version of the V4 bike does not replace their own ST1300 and will not sell well in a shootout with C1400, FJR1300, and K1300GT.

Doesn't matter to me as I'm not a potential buyer anyway, no matter how pretty or how cool. I see absolutely nothing wrong with the FJR I have now as it does everything well for me, even if it only does a few things well for Eric...

 

[jimefjr]

Well, you may think the current BMW models and this new bike are gross, and I might be inclined to agree wit' ya :thumbsup: , but they do sell a good number of those Bavarian albatrosses 'round these parts. And some folks think they look great! There is just no accounting for subjective tastes. I mean, Hells Bells, I just found out this weekend that the best selling beer in the USA is Butt Light!! :blink:
However, I don't think this is the end of the game yet for Honda. Earlier reports indicated that the ST13 replacement was not due out until NEXT year, as in the next model release cycle year, not 2010. I'm inclined to believe that they will be coming up with a completely different packaging of the VFR 1200 engine to replace the ST1300. In the meantime, they will continue to sell off the '09 ST13s they have in back stock.

I'm sure that even Honda realizes that this version of the V4 bike does not replace their own ST1300 and will not sell well in a shootout with C1400, FJR1300, and K1300GT.

Doesn't matter to me as I'm not a potential buyer anyway, no matter how pretty or how cool. I see absolutely nothing wrong with the FJR I have now as it does everything well for me, even if it only does a few things well for Eric...

Oh I know there are lots out there and I have owned two BMW's...they were in the shop all the time...I LOVE MY FJR

 

[SockMonkey]

And Sock, don't argue that until you have a picture of you sitting on one in Seattle or your local dealer.

Nope, wouldn't think of it. Valid points all...

The reality is that I wouldn't buy this bike. It's not because I don't like its aesthetics; I do. I think it's a very attractive bike (though I prefer the white model...). And I really like the fact that Honda is pushing the envelope on both motorcycle engine and transmission technology. It's the ergonomics that I wouldn't enjoy for longer than, oh, about an hour tops (it's just not going to work with a 35+" inseam and an overall abused 47+ year old frame). If I wanted to be (at least) partially wadded up on a sport bike, I'd buy an FZ1.

Truth is, this isn't the kind of bike I'm looking for at all. I have a sport-tourer that I'm quite happy with thank-you-very-much. I would however buy the CB1100 if they'd bring it here (though I still have an itch for an R1200R...).

 

[user 213]

Doesn't matter to me as I'm not a potential buyer anyway, no matter how pretty or how cool. I see absolutely nothing wrong with the FJR I have now as it does everything well for me, even if it only does a few things well for Eric...

Reading comprehension Fred. I said the FJR only does a couple of things really well. I understand you're unable to differentiate from really well and just well. It's ok, it's just how you are. Kinda sad that the FJR does everything well for you. :mellow:

 

[Fred W]

Whatever

 

[wheatonFJR]

...Kinda sad that the FJR does everything well for you. :mellow:

You'd have to be sad for me too... B)

...even if you weren't really sad for Fred.

 

[user 213]

...Kinda sad that the FJR does everything well for you. :mellow:

You'd have to be sad for me too... B)

...even if you weren't really sad for Fred.

Anyone that says the FJR does "everything" well needs to get out more. It's a great bike and I enjoy the hell out of it, but it's not all that great for carving tight twisties, it's just so-so for gravel and dirt roads, it needed serious help for fully loaded touring, as the stock suspension just isn't up to that task, and frankly it's a little cramped for two up if you're a fat ******* like I am. And so much more. It is what it is. No bike does everything really well. And no bike is for everyone.