The FJR as a sportbike

[sprint_st]

To point out something that would normally be obvious, which clearly isn't obvious and before it becomes painfully obvious.
The responses show it to be poorly understood. Comments like "it isn't the bike, it's the rider" are going to get people in trouble. It is the bike. I've seen tales of many riders getting into trouble by forgetting that heavier sport-tourers do not have the same sporting capabilities as lighter sportbikes. It is an easy thing to forget.

I even sugar coated my message by stating that the FJR is a nice bike-- I'm liking mine-- but denials of the obvious was the response.

I no longer give a shjt.

Ride safe.

It's real nice that you no longer give-a-****, but what was that normally obvious point anyhow??? My experience has been that NOTHING is truly obvious to everyone and it is even less "obvious" if the point isn't clearly stated so all parties can figure out what is supposed to be obvious. Please tell me how making a statement like "it isn't the bike, it's the rider" are going to get people in trouble. To motorcycle riders who have riden for a while that statement is intuitively obvious. Honda has a film clip of Nicky Hayden pushing a Gold Wing up near its limits. The bike AIN'T no FREEKIN' sport bike, but with Nicky Hayden on it, it's more of a sport bike than me driving a GSXR. I can't let this one go, to the guy who wants Yamaha to build lighter bags, ya need to rethink that one. Those are probably the best stock bags I've seen. When you start talking about lightening up the FJR, maybe it should be lightening up the rider too. We got some big fella's on FJR's and I'm a light weight at 230. Leave the bags alone!!!

 

[Cdogman]

To point out something that would normally be obvious, which clearly isn't obvious and before it becomes painfully obvious.
The responses show it to be poorly understood. Comments like "it isn't the bike, it's the rider" are going to get people in trouble. It is the bike. I've seen tales of many riders getting into trouble by forgetting that heavier sport-tourers do not have the same sporting capabilities as lighter sportbikes. It is an easy thing to forget.

I even sugar coated my message by stating that the FJR is a nice bike-- I'm liking mine-- but denials of the obvious was the response.

I no longer give a shjt.

Ride safe.

It's real nice that you no longer give-a-****, but what was that normally obvious point anyhow??? My experience has been that NOTHING is truly obvious to everyone and it is even less "obvious" if the point isn't clearly stated so all parties can figure out what is supposed to be obvious. Please tell me how making a statement like "it isn't the bike, it's the rider" are going to get people in trouble. To motorcycle riders who have riden for a while that statement is intuitively obvious. Honda has a film clip of Nicky Hayden pushing a Gold Wing up near its limits. The bike AIN'T no FREEKIN' sport bike, but with Nicky Hayden on it, it's more of a sport bike than me driving a GSXR. I can't let this one go, to the guy who wants Yamaha to build lighter bags, ya need to rethink that one. Those are probably the best stock bags I've seen. When you start talking about lightening up the FJR, maybe it should be lightening up the rider too. We got some big fella's on FJR's and I'm a light weight at 230. Leave the bags alone!!!

Clicky Nikky on a GL1800

I have pushed my goldwing well beyond what is shown in the clip. I am on my second set of footpegs at 16K miles or so, And I have seen scraps on the engine guards of others.

It is a fun bike. Just not as much fun as my FJR.

 

[SilveradoSlick]

To point out something that would normally be obvious, which clearly isn't obvious and before it becomes painfully obvious.
The responses show it to be poorly understood. Comments like "it isn't the bike, it's the rider" are going to get people in trouble. It is the bike. I've seen tales of many riders getting into trouble by forgetting that heavier sport-tourers do not have the same sporting capabilities as lighter sportbikes. It is an easy thing to forget.

I think FJR owners are aware the FJR is not the pinnacle of sporting prowess. Almost all of us have owned (and maybe still do) other bikes. For some of us, the FJR is the best bike we've ever owned but that doesn't mean we believe it's the most sporting bike out there. Those of us who come from sport bikes know the FJR isn't the most sporting bike out there.

By being on this forum, we've all proved we're capable of reading. I suspect the vast majority of us read motorcycle magazines where we can learn about the relative abilities of different bikes. We can also learn that comments like "it isn't the bike, it's the rider" are valid when we read about the expert rider who likes to take the bagger to the track just to humiliate the squids on literbikes. Being aware that rider abilities have a huge impact on lap times doesn't change the fact that it's MY ability that determines how fast I can enter the next corner. I personally do not plan to humiliate a ZX10 with my FJR.

If I understand your point to be that the FJR is not the most sporting bike out there, then I think your point is obvious to myself and other members of this forum. I think you underestimate the intelligence of the forum members. As Clint Eastwood said, "A man's got to know his limits." That very much applies to motorcycles.

 

[Silverbullet]

Although this is a topic pretty much beaten to death, just for .02, There is Motorcycle dealership located right behind where I work. It was owned by a fellow named Steve Baker who won a few races back in the late 1970's. He has sold the dealership, but still works there, and I see him often. If you ever feel the need to see proof of it being the rider and not the bike, come on up to Bellingham Washington, and go for a little ride with him sometime.

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

Although this is a topic pretty much beaten to death, just for .02, There is Motorcycle dealership located right behind where I work. It was owned by a fellow named Steve Baker who won a few races back in the late 1970's. He has sold the dealership, but still works there, and I see him often. If you ever feel the need to see proof of it being the rider and not the bike, come on up to Bellingham Washington, and go for a little ride with him sometime.

Now there's an understatement -- "won a few races" -- he flew the flag on the world circus and was about as good as it gets!

Reminds me of the (apocryphal?) story of the magazine guys arriving at K.R.'s place one weekend and inviting him to go along. Apparently (as the story goes), the only bike available was an old (friend's or neighbor's?) Honda 4cyl 500/550.

K.R. led that day and at the after-ride get-together they asked Kenny what he thought of his borrowed ride. He said he thought it was a pretty good bike.

As Lance Armstrong puts it so well, "It's not the bike."

 

[Cal24Master]

Blah, Blah, Blah this bike is better at this, twin vs. four, sport bike vs. sport tourer. It all comes down to the rider boys! A good rider on a FJR will make a sack lunch out of a poor rider on a Futura, Aprilia, GSXR or what ever bike you want to name. Reg Pridmore says "There is only a handfull of riders in the world that can ride any modern bike it it's potential, and I am not one of them. If you want to ride faster, learn to ride better, not buy faster bikes."

I have passed riders on much better sport bikes, and been passed by riders on bikes I should have been able to walk away from. It all comes down to rider skill.

Tom

IBA #161

 

[airboss]

No matter what the ride. I think this is something, that we all need to keep in mind.

Ride your ride not someone elses.

 

[madmike2]

I think that, lost in the shuffle of responses, was Dan23's original point (however vague and not stated clearly): The FJR isn't the end-all be-all of sport touring.

It probably is for those of us who bought one and enjoy it, but there are others who dabble in the same "niche" of motorcycling and have bikes that can and will out perform the FJR. Should one of us meet and engage one of these road warriors and try to push our bikes beyond our capabilities, there are unkind and expensive results awaiting due to the law of physics.

Its really just that simple.

Now, lets load up and go for a ride.

The older I get, the faster I was...and that's the truthpthpthpth!

 

[sprint_st]

I think that, lost in the shuffle of responses, was Dan23's original point (however vague and not stated clearly): The FJR isn't the end-all be-all of sport touring. The older I get, the faster I was...and that's the truthpthpthpth!

Mike, the problem with this entire thread is that somewhere, by someone, probably Dan23 believe that there is some criteria that defines what a sport tourer is. The FJR definitely is not a sport bike in the R1/GSXR sense, but it isn't a pure tourer either. I believe way too many riders expect a sport tourer to be a sport bike first and tourer somewhere down the line. A good sport tourer is a compromise. It will be the rider who determines how good a compromise that is.

 

[madmike2]

I think that, lost in the shuffle of responses, was Dan23's original point (however vague and not stated clearly): The FJR isn't the end-all be-all of sport touring. The older I get, the faster I was...and that's the truthpthpthpth!

I believe way too many riders expect a sport tourer to be a sport bike first and tourer somewhere down the line. A good sport tourer is a compromise. It will be the rider who determines how good a compromise that is.

I believe the other side of that coin is that many riders came from cruisers or tourers to the FJR. As such, the ability of the bike is vastly superior to what they came from (my personal experience). At some point the technological advances begin to be relied upon because in comparison it handles and feels vastly superior to their past experience. So the SPORT side of the equation becomes part of their belief/trust system. As you stated, it is a compromise bike and it DOES weigh 650+lbs.

I have said in other threads that the best farkle many of us can buy for our bike is a good riding class (with on-track time). I'm not "track day" type, but a day spent with quality teaching opened new vistas for me and also illuminated my lack of expertise and technique. THAT was a good thing. While I love the capabilites of the FJR I must always remember that I'm not a sport rider, IT isn't a sport bike, and the street isn't a race track with controlled conditions..

 

[Tropical FJR]

I've come from the other side - the bike before my FJR was the big dog of sport bikes - the K6 GSX-R 1000. Bike before that was a Blackbird.

To me the FJR is a really great compromise - all day comfortable, and handles surprisingly well for a large bike - better than the 'Bird, IMHO.

The engine is a gem - that fat torque band makes you lazy with the gear shifter....

 

[sprint_st]

I've come from the other side - the bike before my FJR was the big dog of sport bikes - the K6 GSX-R 1000. Bike before that was a Blackbird.To me the FJR is a really great compromise - all day comfortable, and handles surprisingly well for a large bike - better than the 'Bird, IMHO.

The engine is a gem - that fat torque band makes you lazy with the gear shifter....

+1 - Tropical, I think you make a great point, and madmike is probably correct in his assessment as well. I was going to make a comment on the percieved background of FJR riders I have gleaned from the posts on this site but I don't know if I can stand the heat.

 

[Dan23]

Oh, I think my statements in the original post were pretty clear; it just didn't set well with some people.

 

[Dj'sFJR]

Mike, the problem with this entire thread is that somewhere, by someone, probably Dan23 believe that there is some criteria that defines what a sport tourer is. The FJR definitely is not a sport bike in the R1/GSXR sense, but it isn't a pure tourer either. I believe way too many riders expect a sport tourer to be a sport bike first and tourer somewhere down the line. A good sport tourer is a compromise. It will be the rider who determines how good a compromise that is.

Ditto...99% of the time the "rider" will be the determining factor of any bikes limitations, postive or negative...Quick example...I was absolutely blown away from a good friend (Father owned a Honda Dealership/my buddy raced bikes for 25+years) that took my ole' modified (engine only) '78 KZ1000 and did things with it I didn't think were possible. With bias ply tires mind you. This guy had no fear but knew his limitations. I couldn't keep up with him on an '07 GSXR if I tried...my brain wouldn't allow me to "try" what he could do on a bike 25+ years old...anyway IMO the "rider" will determine the "sport" in our beloved FJR's.

Did I get away from the main topic here...lol...Well Rod did you get the PCIII installed yet??

I've come from the other side - the bike before my FJR was the big dog of sport bikes - the K6 GSX-R 1000. Bike before that was a Blackbird.To me the FJR is a really great compromise - all day comfortable, and handles surprisingly well for a large bike - better than the 'Bird, IMHO.

The engine is a gem - that fat torque band makes you lazy with the gear shifter....

+1 - Tropical, I think you make a great point, and madmike is probably correct in his assessment as well. I was going to make a comment on the percieved background of FJR riders I have gleaned from the posts on this site but I don't know if I can stand the heat.

LOL Rod...+2

 

[Dan23]

...probably Dan23 believe that there is some criteria that defines what a sport tourer is.

Don't put words into my mouth and you'll do a lot better understanding what is said.

 

[Dj'sFJR]

Recently, I rode with a friend who was on an Aprilia Futura, which is the same as my other bike. I always knew the FJR was no match for the RST as a sporting bike, but riding along side the Futura put the comparison in stark contrast. Sport-tourer vs sport-tourer.
The longer wheel base of the FJR, the 150 pounds more weight, fewer gear choices, lack of cornering clearance, etc. are all reasons why there's little surprise the RST shows the FJR so painfully lacking in sporting duty.

Now, Motorcycle Daily describes another reason: "...the bike with the lighter reciprocating mass (crankshaft, etc.) will be as fast or faster around the racetrack, due to its ability to carry more corner speed." Not only is the mass of the FJR power train heavier, but more of it is farther from the center, thus multiplying the effect... in-line 4 vs v-2.

Click here ===> https://www.motorcycledaily.com/23january07_800s.htm if you want to read the rest of the article.

None of this means the FJR isn't a great bike; it is one. It just means that you must be sure before choosing a bike what it is that you get vs what you give up... and more importantly: once choosing the FJR don't let your imagination about the FJR lull you into the notion that somehow Yamaha's engineers have rewritten the laws of physics. They have not. And if you do foget, those laws are there to swat you painfully back to your senses.

Climbing down from my soap box now.

I know opinions are like a**holes but...Dan I think most of us here understand what your saying about the "Sport" in the FJR...some of us just don't fully agree...yes the same rider, same day, same conditions, same roads could possibly out perform the FJR with a "Sportier" ST Bike...is that a word? But really, by how much...? If you were to put a very talented rider on your FJR and rode with your friend with the Futura I think you and your friend would be very, very surprised. Not saying your not a great rider, as you may as well be, but the "rider" is the biggest part of this picture not the "sport" in our well rounded FJR's...I'm sure I'm not saying something you don't already know...

I rode the Dragon's Tail (Deals Gap) a couple years ago on my '02 Yamaha Warrior that wears a 210 Metz on the rear (not the most optimum size tire for handling). The Warrior is a "good" handling and braking V-Twin cruiser. I rode with a pack of sport bikes on the way back down staying with in a few bike lenghts of an RC51. I consider myself an above average rider with a zest for speed. This guy couldn't believe he had a "cruiser" on his ass most of the way back down. He looked in his mirror once too many times at how close I was to him coming out of a tight corner and braking for the next and ended up braking a tad too late, locking up the rear and slamming himself into the side of the mountain. Something I'll never forget as it looked to be in slow motion. That was pure rider ability nothing more nothing less...That RC51 with a good rider could have left me at any time he wanted.

We all, cannot deny that a well seasoned rider with above average capabilities could tear most of us a new one with an FJR against most of us on a Sport bike...I personally think the FJR is well equiped to handle just about anything you can throw at it "IF" you have the talent and ability to ride it to its limits and realize it's limits...most of us do not posses that talent or have the balls to try. Maybe its our aging "common sense" thats kicking in too...At times, after 26 years of "playing" on the street and a small amount of track time on other bikes, I think I'm riding pretty damn aggressive on the FJR but I know for a fact I'm not even close to what some can do with this bike without getting bit. JMHO...

 

[Dan23]

But really, by how much...?

:fan_1:

Bingo... we have a winner. That is the counter-point. During normal riding not much will be noticed. It is only when the curves tighten that FJR owners need to keep in mind the limitations of the bike. Yes, like the rest of you, I made the decision that the weight and wheelbase are trade offs that must be balanced against better passenger carrying capabilities, better wind protection and shaft drive.

:fans:

 

[sprint_st]

...probably Dan23 believe that there is some criteria that defines what a sport tourer is.

Don't put words into my mouth and you'll do a lot better understanding what is said.

Didn't put any words into your mouth, that was an observation - my words describing your words. I'm sure you think you have a clear understanding of the point of this nebulous discussion. It's kind of tough to understand a point that really isn't all that clear in the first place. I'll just make my point crystal clear. The concept of a sport bike is well defined. It is a bike that is designed to emulate racing bikes while being street legal and with enough imenities to give it some day to day practicality. On the other end of the scale are touring bikes. These don't have the race bike to focus on, maybe a two wheeled Winnabago is their model. I would submit that Sport Touring is more a state of mind than a particular bike. Therefore, any bike spanning the range from sport to touring can be considered a sport tourer although some have more concensus appeal to the general concept of sport touring. I personally don't believe a Gold Wing is a Sport Tourer, nor is a Hyabusa but if a guy wants to call them a sport tourer there isn't a board of governors to say "no, you can't be a sport tourer." If you believe that an FJR doesn't do the things a GSXR 1000 does well, fine, that's your opinion. There a lot of guys who can close the gap between an FJR and a Gixxer, depending on who's driving. That is why so many guys pounded the point, "it's the rider." When you say "bingo, we have a winner" to "how much" stating that it is a counter point, I say that it is the point. The well ridden FJR can ride with sport bikes and not have to apologize to anyone.

 

[Dan23]

The well ridden FJR can ride with sport bikes and not have to apologize to anyone.

Although I'll admit I fell asleep during your wordy & unformatted response, I did skip to the last line which shows that you still don't get it. I don't care how good a rider you or anyone else is, rider for rider, the FJR will NOT corner like a sportbike will. That is why it is considered a sport-TOURER.

Enough.

 

[sprint_st]

The well ridden FJR can ride with sport bikes and not have to apologize to anyone.

Although I'll admit I fell asleep during your wordy & unformatted response, I did skip to the last line which shows that you still don't get it. I don't care how good a rider you or anyone else is, rider for rider, the FJR will NOT corner like a sportbike will. That is why it is considered a sport-TOURER.

Enough.

:clapping: I get it now :yahoo: You are stating that any rider, no matter what their experience level or riding capabilities will be able to corner better on a sport bike than on an FJR. No wonder I found it so hard. I didn't know you were stating the obvious. I know, "Enough" but one last question, please explain where the "That is why it is considered a sport-TOURER" ruling comes from. Sorry guy, but that is truly YOUR opinion.