To Replace Fork Oil or Not...

[Intech]

IMO the seal mate should only be used to get you through to the earliest opportunity to drain, flush and refill the oil. If it is leaking because of crud...there is your sign. I do mine annually now. I had my forks done by GP at 30K and the bushings were destroyed from the crud that was in the oil. I use cheap transmission fluid to flush them. Interesting to see that someone uses kerosene. BTW when I did them this spring the oil was fairly clear when first dumping and then the crud came from the bottom of the fork. The bike had been sitting, so it had all settled, but I am sure it gets alll mixed up when riding.

 

[Fred W]

The only bad thing that one can say about the seal mate, or its ilk, is that it is taking money out of the pockets of motorcycle mechanics all over the world.

I'm in the other camp. I'm a m/c mech and I buy sealmates a dozen at a time and encourage my customers to use them. What they save on fork seals they end up spending on other service in the future. Gotta keep them coming back.

That's because you are smarter than the average MC wrenching bear, Ray.

IMO the seal mate should only be used to get you through to the earliest opportunity to drain, flush and refill the oil. If it is leaking because of crud...there is your sign. I do mine annually now. I had my forks done by GP at 30K and the bushings were destroyed from the crud that was in the oil. I use cheap transmission fluid to flush them. Interesting to see that someone uses kerosene. BTW when I did them this spring the oil was fairly clear when first dumping and then the crud came from the bottom of the fork. The bike had been sitting, so it had all settled, but I am sure it gets alll mixed up when riding.

I disagree. The crud that you are cleaning out of the seals came from outside the forks, not inside. It's also where all the crud that makes your oil look nasty must come from. In one case I got a leaky seal pretty soon after servicing my forks. The oil was pristine. It wasn't caused from the inside.

Now, OTOH, if you are overdue, I'd go ahead and service them with fresh oil and also clean the seals. But I wouldn't replace them unless I couldn't get them to reseat after cleaning with a seal mate or the like.

 

[Intech]

The only bad thing that one can say about the seal mate, or its ilk, is that it is taking money out of the pockets of motorcycle mechanics all over the world.

I'm in the other camp. I'm a m/c mech and I buy sealmates a dozen at a time and encourage my customers to use them. What they save on fork seals they end up spending on other service in the future. Gotta keep them coming back.

That's because you are smarter than the average MC wrenching bear, Ray.

IMO the seal mate should only be used to get you through to the earliest opportunity to drain, flush and refill the oil. If it is leaking because of crud...there is your sign. I do mine annually now. I had my forks done by GP at 30K and the bushings were destroyed from the crud that was in the oil. I use cheap transmission fluid to flush them. Interesting to see that someone uses kerosene. BTW when I did them this spring the oil was fairly clear when first dumping and then the crud came from the bottom of the fork. The bike had been sitting, so it had all settled, but I am sure it gets alll mixed up when riding.

I disagree. The crud that you are cleaning out of the seals came from outside the forks, not inside. It's also where all the crud that makes your oil look nasty must come from. In one case I got a leaky seal pretty soon after servicing my forks. The oil was pristine. It wasn't caused from the inside.

Now, OTOH, if you are overdue, I'd go ahead and service them with fresh oil and also clean the seals. But I wouldn't replace them unless I couldn't get them to reseat after cleaning with a seal mate or the like.

I agree that the crud comes from the outside, however if you leave it in there long enough it can cause friction damage.

Also, common sense should apply to the use of a seal mate. A situation like yours where something got and stayed in the seal right after a flush is good use for the tool. It is also another good indicator that regular flushes should be done, because the crud DOES get in there.

 

[Ed Sidders]

I don't remember having this problem before someone convinced us that fork gaiters were useless.....

 

[Fred W]

Perzactly. I like these (and just ordered a new pair) NOJ fork guards

 

[e2b]

One look at the old compared to the new fork oil should be a wake up call. About every 30 K + or -

 

[hppants]

OK - I'm convinced - an ounce of prevention... I've got to replace the front tire before my next tour in early October. I'll drain and refill the fork tubes then.

Appreciate the replies.

 

[GPRIDER]

Perzactly. I like these (and just ordered a new pair) NOJ fork guards

Damn Fred. Those look like beer koozies.

GP

 

[Fred W]

They are, sort of. They are just neoprene tubes split on one side and velcroed together to allow the tube to wrap around the fork leg. An enterprising owner could cut a koozie and velcro it together and he'd have custom printed NOJ fork protectors.

FWIW, the NOJ guards only seem to actually be available in black. Not sure why they dhow any other colors. I certainly wouldn't want anything but the black ones.

 

[petey]

C'mon Fred, the pink would look good with a blue bike..

 

[Fred W]

Or yellow, if I was following Iggy's trend setting ways.

 

[dcarver]

Or yellow, if I was following Iggy's trend setting ways.

..and don't forget to cover/protect the rear shock too. Lots of damage can be done there by the elements...

 

[LgFJR]

I called the dealer here on my Gen 1 about changing the fork oil.........his response was wait until it starts leaking and we will just rebuild them for $180..............he implied if you change the fluid they will start leaking and it will turn to crap anyway..............I have no idea if this is the way to go or not.................

 

[Fred W]

Your dealer is a retard

 

[MCRIDER007]

Your dealer is a retard

I don't know if the dealer is a retard but he clearly doesn't know squat about fork maintenance.

 

[FJRMGM]

Your dealer is a retard

I don't know if the dealer is a retard but he clearly doesn't know squat about fork maintenance.

+1 to this...

 

[08FJR4ME]

I called the dealer here on my Gen 1 about changing the fork oil.........his response was wait until it starts leaking and we will just rebuild them for $180..............he implied if you change the fluid they will start leaking and it will turn to crap anyway..............I have no idea if this is the way to go or not.................

I am in the process of rebuilding my forks as I type. Well I will be after I am done typing. $180.00 seems awful cheap to rebuild. It cost me including parts and oil about $89.00 off the top of my head. So $90.00 for laber seem low to me.

So what is that little brass screw on the bottom fork tube? From what I can tell you should be able to drain your oil by taking it out correct? It would be nice to swap out oil and leave the fork tubes in the triple clamps. I would make this a bi-annual service if that is the case. IMO I think the crud in the bottom of the shock is the teflon coating that wears off over time. To me the contaminates come from the working parts. For 59K miles on the bike I expected the oil to look a lot worse. My seals never leaked any oil at all or ever had a problem. I figured it was just time to do it. Yes the bushings did have wear as expected. We will see soon what the results will be.

Got to ride the XR to work today anyway. That was fun.

Dave

 

[MCRIDER007]

I called the dealer here on my Gen 1 about changing the fork oil.........his response was wait until it starts leaking and we will just rebuild them for $180..............he implied if you change the fluid they will start leaking and it will turn to crap anyway..............I have no idea if this is the way to go or not.................

I am in the process of rebuilding my forks as I type. Well I will be after I am done typing. $180.00 seems awful cheap to rebuild. It cost me including parts and oil about $89.00 off the top of my head. So $90.00 for laber seem low to me.

So what is that little brass screw on the bottom fork tube? From what I can tell you should be able to drain your oil by taking it out correct?

NO............................Make that HELL NO!

 

[Fred W]

I called the dealer here on my Gen 1 about changing the fork oil.........his response was wait until it starts leaking and we will just rebuild them for $180..............he implied if you change the fluid they will start leaking and it will turn to crap anyway..............I have no idea if this is the way to go or not.................

I am in the process of rebuilding my forks as I type. Well I will be after I am done typing. $180.00 seems awful cheap to rebuild. It cost me including parts and oil about $89.00 off the top of my head. So $90.00 for laber seem low to me.

Agreed. Supports my initial impression that he is a retard.

So what is that little brass screw on the bottom fork tube? From what I can tell you should be able to drain your oil by taking it out correct? It would be nice to swap out oil and leave the fork tubes in the triple clamps. I would make this a bi-annual service if that is the case.

Won't really work, Dave. The allen bolt in the bottom of each fork (which isn't really brass) is what holds the cartridge in the lower fork slider. You could probably take it out and then pump some of the oil out of the fork. It would make a ridiculous mess and I don't think you'd get all of the oil out either.

IMO I think the crud in the bottom of the shock is the teflon coating that wears off over time. To me the contaminates come from the working parts. For 59K miles on the bike I expected the oil to look a lot worse. My seals never leaked any oil at all or ever had a problem. I figured it was just time to do it. Yes the bushings did have wear as expected. We will see soon what the results will be.

Sounds like you replaced the bushings (good idea with those miles). I happen to agree with you. I think that most of what makes the oil look yucky so quickly is the worn teflon liner material from those bushings. I think when seals start leaking it is due to outside contamination (bug guts and road spooge getting under the lip of the seal) not due to the yucky oil. Which is why the seal mate seems to work so successfully. Clean the bug guts and you are good to go.

Question? Did you replace all three seals? I would have been tempted to just intall the top and bottom one ( a la' 1st gen) and skip the middle one that seems to cause all of the problems during diss-assembly and also increases the wear rate of the bushings due to having three points of contact on the inner stationary tube.

PS - My old forks with new bushings seem to have less stiction than the old ones, which should make the fork more responsive over small road irregularities. I feel that this is definitely true, but I also swapped out all the valving on my forks at the same time, so can't assign all the good new feeling to the bushings.

 

[hppants]

Just a follow-up here. This was definitely worth $20.00 and an hour of time. Replaced the fork oil last night - today, the big girl gets a new front shoe.

Holy crap - that old fork oil was filthy. I'm not going to analyze the oil or anything, but it looked like extremely thin rear end oil after 100K, rather than any kind of used hydraulic oil.

As a side note - you can't get a torque wrench on the lower triple tree bolts. No way, no how. So I applied the Cajun torque wrench spec - a 1/2 turn before it breaks.

Looking forward to seeing if the ride is different. At a minimum, I'm sure this will extend my fork seal and bushing life.