We gotta curb this crashing trend, It's not just us

[Toecutter]

Just spoke with Wayne Boyer at Cycleport about setting up a meet with the motor officer squad at Fresno P.D. He's already outfitting Sacramento and he's negotiating with CHP.

Wayne confirms the upturn in crash frequency, as he said he usually averages about two suits per week returned post-crash, but lately he's up to about seven or eight on average. He also said that most riders are being well-protected by the suits, but many are suffering concussions. Maybe time to re-visit the helmet safety thread and re-evaluate your gear?

If there are that many more crashing with Cycleport gear on (5+ per week), imagine how many are crashing without it.

This is not good. Being careful isn't good enough, apparently, so BE MORE CAREFULLER AND WEAR THE RIGHT GEAR!

 

[mdisher]

Based upon that uptick, I'd ask what's wrong with their gear that's causing the new rash in crashes

 

[painman]

I sure have to agree Bob with the numbers. Yesterday I went to "another" funeral of a friend who left this earth while riding his HD on Labor Day weekend. With all the wrecks going on I'm paranoid to leave the house, especially on my bike. Out of the many years of biking this is the worse I've seen. Not good. One thing observed though, those who were wearing ATGATT have done way better than those who did not. PM. <><

 

[exskibum]

Too much crashing, for sure. I wouldn't say I'm spooked, but I AM altering some of my riding patterns to get a little further away from the edge. Too much speed in group situations when and where we don't need to go that fast has really begun to concern me, especially when I'm 2 up. It's taking away from the fun for me, and scaring my GF is over the line. On a related note, having anything else in my head but riding and being in the moment (such as judgments regarding others' speed or group positions) is not good for staying on the rubber.

I can't afford to crash and be laid up or to pay to get myself repaired. As to the helmet thread and the research done a couple years ago for Motorcyclist, I think there are a couple competing issues. The non Snell helmets demonstrated better performance in avoiding concussions, but IIRC, only to a point. That point was that they performed better in the typical glancing blow off the pavement, which is the most common occurrence. While I don't recall them specifically saying so, I do recall the Snell testing as better addressing the helmet's ability to withstand a more direct impact (paraphrasing, but that's how I understood it). If I'm going to hit a guardrail post or tree with my head, I might prefer the Snell certified helmet -- like I have, and like madmike2 was wearing.

Just my 2 cents.

Please, let's stop the crashing!

 

[madmike2]

If I'm going to hit a guardrail post or tree with my head, I might prefer the Snell certified helmet -- like I have, and like madmike2 was wearing.
Please, let's stop the crashing!

[SIZE=12pt]Amen![/SIZE] To both of your points.......

 

[weekend rider]

Maybe to many baby boomers buying bikes with to much power and notenough quality riding skills ????????

just a thought

 

[painman]

I hear what your saying and also agree weekend rider. But just wanted make a side note here, 90% of the recent crashes I'm sorry to say have known the ones involved, the rider was "not" at fault. It was either a freek solo accident or a cage tried or did run them over. PM. <><

 

[Toecutter]

As to the helmet thread and the research done a couple years ago for Motorcyclist, I think there are a couple competing issues. The non Snell helmets demonstrated better performance in avoiding concussions, but IIRC, only to a point. That point was that they performed better in the typical glancing blow off the pavement, which is the most common occurrence. While I don't recall them specifically saying so, I do recall the Snell testing as better addressing the helmet's ability to withstand a more direct impact (paraphrasing, but that's how I understood it). If I'm going to hit a guardrail post or tree with my head, I might prefer the Snell certified helmet -- like I have, and like madmike2 was wearing.

And that, as they say, is the hell of it.

One never knows how the impact will be fashioned, or we could wear the right hat for the job. I didn't mean to say "Don't wear a Snell", but rather, "Educate yourself and make a decision based on an informed position". I'm going with the odds that my helmet provides better protection for the majority of impacts.

Eve's boss (in a Snell helmet) got a debilitating brain injury and a broken jaw from a pavement strike, at 30 mph.

JB got a concussion from a low-speed flop (Snell). Hal's wife probably hit just as hard as JB did, and walked it off (Non-Snell).

Mike may very have been toast in a lesser helmet, so thank heavens he was wearing the right one for the impact he received, and I pray I don't go head-first into a solid object at speed. Short of prophecy, we just have to roll them bones and see what happens. And I hope none of us ever needs our helmet, but reality tells me different.

 

[Kevin Daly]

Ok I'm just going to put this out there and see how it sits with people.

Of course I am a purist when it comes to riding. ATGATT; full leather even on the hottest days. I never ride two-up, never listen to music, dont have a sippy cup or camel pak, no GPS or tank mounted maps (PS I never got lost... unintentionally ), no blue tooth, not even a radar detector. When I am thursty I stop to drink, hungry, I stop to eat. if I need to talk to the wife I stop. I stop to eat a lot, anyone who rides with me will tell you I have my bags full of snack foods and usually several bottles of gatoraide. But when I ride, it's the ONLY thing I am doing. Havent crashed in 20 plus years, havent had a speeding ticket in as many. Anyone who rides with me knows I go pretty fast (but not insanely so). Though I tend to ride alone or with maybe one or two other bikes because the few times i ride in large groups I find others riding beyond their means and/or just risking the saftey of the people around them.

So I am just wondering about two factors. One, is it possible that the amount of gizmos that people have mounted in on and around their bikes just be a little distracting. Perhaps it takes just a little edge off the focus. Second, as more 40+ yr olds start rediscovering the joy of biking and get hooked up in larger groups of bikes with a bunch of similarly experienced people, that peer pressure (its not just for teens anymore) doesnt push people to chase the pase setter just a little harder than they would normally go and increase their risk level.

ok so my 2 cents, what do you all think??

PS great thread Toe!

 

[Scab]

One never knows how the impact will be fashioned, or we could wear the right hat for the job. I didn't mean to say "Don't wear a Snell", but rather, "Educate yourself and make a decision based on an informed position". I'm going with the odds that my helmet provides better protection for the majority of impacts.

I wore a DOT during my crash. I took a hard impact behind the left ear. 29 broke bones, but none were in the head. I'm sticking with my DOT.

Ok I'm just going to put this out there and see how it sits with people. So I am just wondering about two factors. One, is it possible that the amount of gizmos that people have mounted in on and around their bikes just be a little distracting. Perhaps it takes just a little edge off the focus. Second, as more 40+ yr olds start rediscovering the joy of biking and get hooked up in larger groups of bikes with a bunch of similarly experienced people, that peer pressure (its not just for teens anymore) doesnt push people to chase the pase setter just a little harder than they would normally go and increase their risk level.

For me, music is not a distraction and actually helps me mentally focus. But, the peer pressure is the real deal.

 

[HaulinAshe]

For me, music is not a distraction and actually helps me mentally focus. But, the peer pressure is the real deal.

Me too! I'm not riding with any of you crazy *******s ever again!

 

[James Burleigh]

So I am just wondering about two factors. One, is it possible that the amount of gizmos that people have mounted in on and around their bikes just be a little distracting. Perhaps it takes just a little edge off the focus. Second, as more 40+ yr olds start rediscovering the joy of biking and get hooked up in larger groups of bikes with a bunch of similarly experienced people, that peer pressure (its not just for teens anymore) doesnt push people to chase the pase setter just a little harder than they would normally go and increase their risk level.
ok so my 2 cents, what do you all think??

PS great thread Toe!

Okay, I'll bite. First of all, hat's off to you for setting a high personal standard and model of responsible riding. (When I came back into this thread it was because I thought it'd be fun to say, "Gee, this all makes me think I really need to stop going up between cars on the freeway at 80 MPH like I did on the way home tonight." :huh: )

I don't think gadgets are causing folks to crash. I think it's two things: 1, inexperience coupled with high performance (I think most riders are infrequent riders), and 2, being human, which causes us to lose concentration and / or do fun (crazy) stuff, like [see previous parenthetical].

If we all always rode our motorcycles like we were driving a car.... Well, I guess there are folks (maybe a LOT or 'em) who don't ride because it's a g*damn thrill, but I sure get a kick in the pants out of twisting that throttle and pushing those handlebars left and right.

Of course I do try to mitigate all that with (1) training (MSF basic, two Experienced Rider courses, and a racetrack class, plus constant braking / swerving practice), (2) mental concentration and clarity (stay mentally engaged; never drink & ride; stay hydrated; keep energy up; take breaks), and (3) good hazard anticipation strategies (those two cars may have been going 72 MPH, but they WERE going straight! :lol: )

I think you made a lot of good points, and that your remarks basically covered 90% of the causes.

Jb

 

[Scab]

Me too! I'm not riding with any of you crazy *******s ever again!

Good thing I'm a crazy S.O.B. I hate them crazy *******s too.

 

[Kevin Daly]

Okay, I'll bite. First of all, hat's off to you for setting a high personal standard and model of responsible riding. (When I came back into this thread it was because I thought it'd be fun to say, "Gee, this all makes me think I really need to stop going up between cars on the freeway at 80 MPH like I did on the way home tonight." :huh: )

Hey who said anything about responsible riding , I just meant i dont do things that distract my when i am being irresponsible

never drink & ride

Man, you'd think that would go without saying!

 

[James Burleigh]

never drink & ride

Man, you'd think that would go without saying!

Ever see a bike parked in front of a bar? (We know what kind of bike we're talkin' about.) So nope, it don't go without saying. Statistically, if you never drink and ride, you cut in HALF your chances of being killed on a motorcycle. For me that means two hours between one beer and riding.

 

[Scab]

Another thing, even average motorcycles in have evolved into very capable machines that don't lend themselves to the physics of "forgiveness." Most, I think, would survive our mistakes without incident if we were all on mopeds. I think alot of incidents can be attributed to nothing more than the physics. People make mistakes, always have, always will. But now our machines are bigger, heavier, and more powerfull. The margin for error has become very, very slim.

 

[Kevin Daly]

never drink & ride

Man, you'd think that would go without saying!

Ever see a bike parked in front of a bar? (We know what kind of bike we're talkin' about.) So nope, it don't go without saying. Statistically, if you never drink and ride, you cut in HALF your chances of being killed on a motorcycle. For me that means two hours between one beer and riding.

Hell, i wont even drink a beer and ride that day. But yeah, your absolutely right, there is a completely different culture out there; i wish they were on a different set of roads

 

[Scab]

Statistically, if you never drink and ride, you cut in HALF your chances of being killed on a motorcycle. For me that means two hours between one beer and riding.

Now, I would have thought you would have DOUBLED your chances of being killed.

Edit: Oops. Now I read the word NEVER in that sentence James wrote. Where's my sign?

 

[Kevin Daly]

Another thing, even average motorcycles in have evolved into very capable machines that don't lend themselves to the physics of "forgiveness." Most, I think, would survive our mistakes without incident if we were all on mopeds. I think alot of incidents can be attributed to nothing more than the physics. People make mistakes, always have, always will. But now our machines are bigger, heavier, and more powerfull. The margin for error has become very, very slim.

Well i dont know about mopeds but yeah lighter weaker bikes might be safer, i just dont know. My feeling is that there are very few circumstances on the FJR that I feel like the mass and power of the bike (say relative to my 650 nighthawk of yars past) is any less nimble or forgiving; its just a different mindset to manuver a heavier bike.