Winter Project - Reviving a Wounded FJR

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If it's an AE engine, you're going to have significant problems. Gear position on the AE is with a potentiometer, for the A it's a switch. The neutral indication is by part of the gear position switch on the A, and a separate switch on the AE. I suspect there are other significant differences in the ECU and instrument cluster, as well as the wiring loom, though I haven't checked with the part numbers. I suggest you check these before proceeding.

 
Is that the engine out of an AE?
Certainly looks like it. Let's hope it's as easy as swapping out AE pieces for standard and it'll work...
--G
I think there are some fundamental transmission differences i.e. neutral at the bottom for AE. Since the tranny is the issue with the current engine, it might not be good news. Hope I'm wrong.
Totally spaced the revised shift pattern...
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--G

 
Alright! Things slowed down a bit this weekend. Some other house stuff and out side of house stuff needed attention.
I do have pics to post on the current progress which will most likely get posted tomorrow.

I have a question though which puzzles me. Here's a pic of my CURRENT 2007 engine coming out:

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And here's a pic of the "new" engine to be installed:

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I'd like some assistance identifying what "Gen/Version" of clutch slave cylinder is on the replacement AND the stuff next to it - Black connector etc.

I'm hoping I can just move what I have to the replacement, but IF this engine is from another year.... I'd like to ID just what year that is! Everything else SEEMS like it's the same as far as I can tell.

Thoughts? (and thanks!)
Ok, seeing as you have an AE engine, which in order to make work properly with your bike, you'd have to split the motor and change the shift barrel and associated hardware out, that leaves you with a few options.

Option 1: Sell the AE motor and split the motor with the bad transmission to start replacing parts. I believe that's your best bet, more on that in a bit.

Option 2: Split both motors and swap out the shift barrel & associated hardware plus all of the other bad parts associated with your broken trans motor. This leaves you with a spare engine, and some used transmission gears/forks/whatever to fix your broken engine. If you're going to go this route, I'd be interested to see how the gear dogs and pockets look on an AE auto shift motor with (how many?) miles, so take pictures please! This also gives you an additional 16 valve shims to work with should you want to re-shim, and you'll also have a bunch of parts handy for replacement of anything that more than likely won't go wrong with your original 60,000 mile motor.

Option 3: Sell the AE motor and buy an A motor, preferably '08 or later (updated trans). Probably the easiest route but seriously not much easier.

With all three options, you'd still want to make sure you end up with a newer 'blue dot' cam chain tensioner.

I've had my motor out of my '06 bike to fix the "popping out of 2nd gear" issue that's common with many big displacement high torque bikes, and unfortunately I'll probably be doing it again this winter to fix the same issue. This other transmission issue your new bike has is kind of an anomaly; most people have the issue I had, I don't remember reading about any other transmission failures with any year FJR. I do have to tell you the biggest ***** is getting the motor out of the bike, and you're already half way there apparently.

Dis-assembly of this motor is not rocket science at all, it's fairly straightforward. If you decide to go this route, myself and a slew of others on the forum could talk you through it if you run into any difficulties. Along with whatever broken trans parts you're replacing, remember to buy new gaskets, coolant tube o-rings, and the 10 main bearing bolts which according to the service manual are one use only. Pick up a service manual if you haven't already. Or get a .pdf copy of one online from...somewhere, it's out there. Or both. That's still the cheapest route, IMHO. Either way, I'd start with splitting the bad trans motor and finding out what you can about what is broken. You might even get lucky and find a newer trans for sale; I scored one for cheap from a forum member when I did mine.

You can go to the Yamaha OEM parts supplier website of your choice and compare part numbers between the A and AE bikes (I use Yamaha Sports Plaza). From what I can tell the only difference to the motor internally is the shift barrel and its hardware, which unfortunately means you're still in for splitting the motor. If you decide to split the bad trans motor, please take pictures and document, that kind of information is definitely appreciated here, and it's part of what this forum is all about.

Keep us all posted on which way you decide to go.

 
There's one other possibility.

Hold your breath, here it comes.

Return it to the selller and get your money back. In his (forgive my wording) ignorance, he sold you the WRONG engine. I know, I know, business is business, buyer beware, and all that... but for most of us, if any one of us sold you that engine, and it didn't work, we'd make it right. You said the seller was great. Really? When I hear that word, I think of someone committed to doing the right thing. Did you tell him what he's done? Does he even know? A great seller is one who not only treats you right when you buy, but stands behind what he's selling.

Should you expect him to give your money back? No. Should you at least tell him and give him an opportunity to make it right? Absolutely. If I were the seller, I'd feel awful if the buyer never gave me the opportunity to make it right after giving me HOW MUCH MONEY... for something he couldn't use because of my lack of knowledge.

We all know what is right, and what a seller ought to do in a case like this.

My question: have you told him?

Gary

darksider #44

 
I wonder if dcarver still has his old engine hanging around from the swap he did last year? His problem was with the top end so the tranny is still probably OK (although with high miles on it). Bet you could get it for very low cost or (better yet) find a lower mileage "dead" engine (preferably 2008+) with a good transmission to use as a replacement to use in the AE engine.

Since you are already into it pretty far, you might investigate the state of the transmission in your old engine, as suggested by rPGoatBoy. It might not need too much and since its out of the bike, a couple of hours should tell you where you stand. You can then decide whether to repair it, find a donor for your old engine or for the newer AE engine. Either way, you have some wrenching to do.

Note: To some, a 60,000 mile motorcycle engine is well-worn but if it was treated well, it isn't even middle age!

 
RossKean, Garyahouse andrPGoatboy(with the slight mod to either opton 1 or 3 of returnign it instead of reselling) hit it dead on...

Without a great deal of work, that engine is just not going to be the right one for that bike and you will make compromises to get it working. You are investing a lot of time and effort in this project, you want to be proud of your result and confident in it's suitability for purpose.

Unless you have nothing but free time and a buddy in the yamaha parts business, you would be best served to try and return it, or, sell it and get the motor/trans, you need for the job.

I found the ebay listing... the seller says "If you have a problem when you receive your item, email or call us @ 336-347-7335"

...Call him :)

They have a 99.9 rating... and ebay is VERY hard on sellers that do not satisfy the customer (even if the customer is wrong). If you force it.. you will come out on top.. Not saying you should.. but am saying you should call and ask...

I'd bet you will eat the shipping cost... which will be less than you will spend on extra parts (and time) to make this work. I sell on eBay sometimes, I have a 100% rating... those with conciences and great ratings like to know our buyers are happy. eBay will refund him all of his costs except shipping...so it wouldnt be a loss to him(unless he paid for some of the shipping).. he'd be right back where he started if he cooperates and refunds you...no harm no foul.

Any salvage yard shoulda at least asked you the model... a good salvage yard should have asked you the trans type... a great salvage yard woulda advised you on the caveats of doing what you are considering.

As others have said, If you are going to split cases anyway, wouldnt you be better off just splitting the OE motor, figureing out which parts failed, and replacing them? I'd not split a motor i just spent a grand on...

Good luck with this, I admire your ambition (and you do have a great looking shop!!! )

 
Hey Guys, thanks for the notes. It's weird how my thoughts appeared in your posts!
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First off, as you said Pilot, I did contact the seller. They are DL Salvage in North Carolina. I've been dealing with Todd there and he's been excellent! Through the shipping process and now with the incompatibility (yes... I dreamed for a second it would work... flatulated, then came back to reality!). I will be sending the AE engine back for a full refund minus shipping. And I'm ok with that. They will be actively looking for another engine for me as well. No guarantees but I appreciate the efforts.

Side note: DL Salvage has some other parts from the 2007 AE bike on their site for sale if anyone is looking. I made sure to tell them that the computer and other electronics should tagged specifically for the AE model. They weren't.

My buddy mentioned in the first post with the 2004... the frustrated and now bored engineer wants to split the case on the problem engine.
crazy.gif
? why not. Let's see what's inside! This guy is a great friend and a huge help. So you can say this is a "Plan B" approach.

My riding lately has been what it used to be. I've put about 40K on my Concours in the last 8 years. It now has 55K and that thing will last well past 100! So, yeah. 60K on an engine isn't bad at all.

Now!

Let's get back on schedule with the tear down pics!

 
We last left our Patient stripped of all coverings and connected to a trickle charge "drip".... ok the battery is totally removed as well.

It's time to drain the fluids! That small bolt at the bottom of the water pump was loosened and then removed. Woosh! all the green stuff came pouring out!

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Then the radiator was removed.... hmm. Looks more FJ than FJR now. Kinda.

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Attention was moved to the exhaust. I had to tap these bolts a bit to get them loose.

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Lookin kinda funny wit yer pants on the ground...... Gah! That song is still bad!

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I somehow figured the exhaust may come off in one peice. This turned into a slight challenge as I was working alone. But it did!

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Can you hear me now?

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Sweet...Sorry for your troubles, but you are making awesome progress. That is great news about the engine. Those guys deserve some really good karma. Too many places these days make a sale and then walk away.

I've been following this with interest. Lurking like crazy, but wishing you well. Keep at it!!

 
The next day I decided to distract myself with some DVR'd Sports Car racing.......

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I can't que up MotoGP or any two wheel racing.... for THAT, I need to give it my undivided attention!

I continued to pull various parts off from the top now. Some of the plumbing did NEED to come off, but I figured it would slip out of the frame easier if it did.

IMG_1670.jpg


The air box gave me a fit! I figured, 4 screws and it would separate. Easy!......... (insert head scratching and muttled swearing)..... ok AH! a few more screws.... now I got..... OY! What The......... more screws!! Sheesh! I finally loosened the throttle body boots and was able to gently manuever the box out that way. THEN I discovered that screw in the center of the box! Le Sigh!.....

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Look Bubba! A 4 Barrel Carberatorizer! (N'yuk)

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I next spent some time cleaning up the throttle bodies. I started by retrieving my throttle body cleaner from the cabinet. Shaking. Aim. Depress the button. aaaaand...... fssssth...... dribble.
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I had liquid but no push to get it out! (pause while StreetHawk exits stage left and heads to the local Autozone to resupply)

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Only the lower half of the butterflies got gunked. Interesting.

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We'll end today with a much lightened, wounded FJR. A Work In Progress for sure. But so far, (even through the crap and Revelations) well worth it!

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Now that everything is clearing out I can't help but stare down at the shock and think..... "Hmmm. It'd be EASY to drop a Penske in there now!"

Hmmmmmmm.........

 
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Sorry for your glitch in motors, but it provided for great information sharing!!! Now if only Congress would get their act together so you can go to work and really slow this winter project back to its regularly appointed pace!!!

 
Sorry for your glitch in motors, but it provided for great information sharing!!! Now if only Congress would get their act together so you can go to work and really slow this winter project back to its regularly appointed pace!!!
I was recalled this week. What I do (indirectly) supports our Hero's (i.e. Men and Women Serving) in the field.

So things will slow down a bit. Which means I can take time to think of "While it's apart...." stuff to do as well.

I do have a few more pics to show of my current progress......

 
Needless to say the hardware buckets are filling. I'm really trying to keep as much labeled and sorted as possible!

IMG_1691.jpg


In preparation to remove the shaft drive, I started dismantling the left foot peg. THIS bugger scared me. It's a 10mm Torx screw. (I don't have a bit big enough!)
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Luckily for me it was a little loose and I was able to get it off by hand.

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Kickstand removal....... Honey, what do you mean I can't put that shirt in the washer?
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N'yuk.....

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Exposed Shafty! I thought that slash in the housing there was not normal!
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After some investigation I think it is.... Is it? It's just a strange pattern in the cut.

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Just forget what you know now and pretend this is FJR Christmas times!!
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The "new" engine was delivered, picked up and hauled to the basement shop! Sucker is heavy! 200+ pounds with the crate. So WHAT'S IN THE BOOOOOOX!?

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IMG_1706.jpg


I had help for a few hours. His name is Doug (Friend described earlier). Doug and I took to removing some of the engine mount bolts..... it went well until....

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The bolt holding the clutch side frame slider was not budging! We heated and cranked.........

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Applied air tools! But alas my tank won't kick out the torque needed........... (sigh)
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So I wound up continuing to soak the sucker as best as I could with PB Blaster. I would hit it at all the spots I could then walk away..................

(rinse and repeat - not literally rinse..... you get the idea)

And wait....................... ........ . ................... . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . *to be continued

 
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Exposed Shafty! I thought that slash in the housing there was not normal!
stitchfacesmiley.png
After some investigation I think it is.... Is it? It's just a strange pattern in the cut.
IMG_1702.jpg


Applied air tools! But alas my tank won't kick out the torque needed........... (sigh)
rolleyes.gif

IMG_1711.jpg


So I wound up continuing to soak the sucker as best as I could with PB Blaster. I would hit it at all the spots I could then walk away..................
First picture -- while that 'slash/cut' is not normal, it is exactly typical of all FJRs.

Second picture -- Tiny air line. Does your tank top out ~120 psi? Second, do you have an oiler on the air line? Big shop air tanks will have >160 psi on tap. Unless your air gun is different than most, they like to sip air tool oil, and it makes a real difference in their true torque capability.

Second picture -- Sometimes you can get a bolt to break free by trying to TIGHTEN it a tiny bit, if it moves at all in the tighten direction it will back right out. Unless you have a torque adjustable air wrench try the tighten maneuver with a hand wrench.

Second picture -- You don't suppose someone used Green Loctite? :fie:

 
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Yeah Fun, tiny air line... whimpy tank! She's limited to 90 psi. It's main purpose is to keep air in the vehicles. The slight tighten and back off method was employed.

As far as the Loctite? I was thinking Red ... I've not seen Green. Let me guess, it doubles as Epoxy.....
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I have a similar compressor by Sears with the the 90# limit.. Drives me crazy when I try to use any air tools so I satisfy myself with checking tire pressures every Saturday morning. Subscribed to the thread.

 
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