running bad (feeling blessed)...limped home (walking on air)

majicmaker said:

James Burleigh said:

I think this is your solution:

https://ichinda.co.in/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/2013-Yamaha-FJR1300A-Super-Sports-Tourer-specifications.jpg

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That's cold blooded Mr JB. Funny as Hell but, Cold Blooded! Just Sayin' )

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now datz funny shirt...I'll come back to this if I hit the lottery or when my MIL croaks

RossKean said:

Patriot said:

that's "never seize" on threads

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Have a look at the NGK Technical Bulletin. Obviously not related to your problem but FYI.

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thank you...I had no clue those plugs purposely had a coating on the threads...no more anti-seize

as an aside, I'm satisfied I can effectively use the "wrist as torque wrench" for plugs

have done so all my life...usually use left hand/wrist as it's weaker than my right

<won't go there any further!>

kamal said:

Just an idea.I had almost the same problem last Fall. Bike stalled turning on to an off-ramp (luckily down hill). Eventually it re-started, but wouldn't run under 2,000 rpm. It was pissing rain so I limped home and parked the bike in my shop to dry off. Same situation next morning. I remembered reading an old post https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php/topic/22734-main-ecu-connector-contamination/?do=findComment&comment=268059 , lifted the tank and found the connectors were green with corrosion. Cleaned them and sealed with dialectric grease, re-started the bike - no more problem!

Al.

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just studied this thread, and regardless of outcome, I need to address this...thanx much

Patriot said:

kamal said:

Just an idea.
I had almost the same problem last Fall. Bike stalled turning on to an off-ramp (luckily down hill). Eventually it re-started, but wouldn't run under 2,000 rpm. It was pissing rain so I limped home and parked the bike in my shop to dry off. Same situation next morning. I remembered reading an old post https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php/topic/22734-main-ecu-connector-contamination/?do=findComment&comment=268059 , lifted the tank and found the connectors were green with corrosion. Cleaned them and sealed with dialectric grease, re-started the bike - no more problem!

Al.

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just studied this thread, and regardless of outcome, I need to address this...thanx much

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Al.

I ran diagnostic on TBS and it tested good while cold.

Guess I'll put it back together and see how it idles & runs...

if good, I'll let it warm up to 2 bars and run the test/diag again.

I'll also try to clean the easy to get at electrical plugs like the tbs one above

and that others have reported corroded on their bike

ECU plug looks/is fine

oh, btw, does anyone know if '05's had the tbs recall

my second engine is an '05, so my recall on original engine is not applicable

Yes, the early '05s had the TPS recall. The later ones had the newer part from the factory.

Geezer said:

Yes, the early '05s had the TPS recall. The later ones had the newer part from the factory.

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I probably can't tell at this point which one I have...no VIN of bike the engine came from

how about a part # for '05 TBS...I don't know where it is or how much it costs even is just curious

3P6-85885-00-00

$131.22

https://www.ronayers.com/ProductDetails/N/687/SKU/811359

You also don't know yet that you need one. Like I said on the phone, let it go!

But it's 3P6-85885-00-00, and the best I found was Partzilla at 130-something. Most were around 150.

But you don't know that you need it, so let it go!

EDIT: Tree'd while searching. But he didn't talk to you on the phone and tell you that your TPS is OK, since we swept it full range on the diag screen and the numbers ran smoothly, at least while cold.

wfooshee said:

You also don't know yet that you need one. Like I said on the phone, let it go!

But it's 3P6-85885-00-00, and the best I found was Partzilla at 130-something. Most were around 150.

But you don't know that you need it, so let it go!

EDIT: Tree'd while searching. But he didn't talk to you on the phone and tell you that your TPS is OK, since we swept it full range on the diag screen and the numbers ran smoothly, at least while cold.

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I wanted the part # so I can look where it is on the fische just for my knowledge base

<strawberry sounds smiley>

edit: well now I see it and it's on top so easy to replace if necessary

this engine was removed last fall at 140k bike, 50k engine mi and my mechanic Aaron reports he checked and cleaned all the electrical plug connections. so I'm confident that's probably not an issue

looked closely at the fische for the injection system vac lines and checked those closely...no issues I can see

and when the engine was out, I had the injectors sent out to be cleaned and checked and tuned.

they said the injectors were in good shape even before they did the work

https://www.mpsracing.com/products/MPS/Injector_Cleaning.asp

I never said to just replace it. I said that the symptoms sound very much like it could be the problem and is worth investigating. Like just by starting the bike again and seeing how it runs cold. It is a well known and widespread problem with the first gen bikes, which was why Yamaha forked out the money to do that recall. Just reading up on some of the posts that led up to the recall might be helpful to you.

Running the diag test for a faulty TPS is a difficult one because of what I mentioned before, it usually only screws up when hot. So the most condemning symptom is to start the bike and run it cold. If it is still screwed up cold with good cold TPS diag test, look elsewhere for your problem. But if everything seems normal when cold, run it 'till it's hot again and starts to act up (not just to two bars), then quickly jump into the diag screen and observe those numbers again as you slowly twist the throttle.

It is definitely a possibility that the recall hasn't been completed, or that the donor engine hadn't had it done. Lots of folks didn't have it done if their bike was running OK. But, even if it has been replaced and you have the new fangled TPS on your bike, that doesn't preclude a failure. TPS's fail all the time on all different types of bikes, the majority have not been recalled. The TPS on my V-strom failed with exactly the same symptoms as what happens on the FJR, and it's just what you described.

The other condemning evidence in the case of the Suzuki's TPS (which doesn't have the handy diag screen) is once it stated to act up, I could pull over, stop the engine and with the key off twist the throttle fully back and forth vigorously a dozen or so times and then restart the engine and it would be OK for a while. I'm not sure that trick would work on the Yamaha TPS, though it might be something to try after you've seen the bad numbers on the diag screen. The theory is that the wiper arm isn't getting good contact with the resistive trace inside the sensor, which is basically a giant potentiometer (if that means anything to you.)

A brief call to any dealership with Yamaha warranty service capability will reveal if the recall has ever been completed against your bike's (frame) VIN. If it hasn't they will do it for free.

If you find that you have to replace it, it isn't all that difficult. I wouldn't replace it (on my own dime) unless I had proven to myself that it is the problem.

I think you may be going astray with the TPS. The main clue here were the spark plugs and it appears that cylinders 2 & 3 were not firing either because of no spark or no fuel. It is possible to use the diagnostics to test the injectors to make sure that the injectors are getting a signal to open. If the injectors test good I would check your plug wires are in good condition and then start looking at the coils and the rest of the ignition system.

Going astray?

How hard would it be to start the bike again when it's cold? If the problem is the spark or injectors it will still be there cold.

yamafitter said:

I think you may be going astray with the TPS. The main clue here were the spark plugs and it appears that cylinders 2 & 3 were not firing either because of no spark or no fuel. It is possible to use the diagnostics to test the injectors to make sure that the injectors are getting a signal to open. If the injectors test good I would check your plug wires are in good condition and then start looking at the coils and the rest of the ignition system.

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I mentioned I could see a spark on all 4 plugs when hooked to the wires and grounded to the engine. I did each separately while spinning the engine with the starter. Now how good those sparks are to run the engine is another question.

Will report on next step as Fred suggests.

My VIN has never had the TBS replaced...I still have the recall letter somewhere. What I'd like to happen TBS wise is they replace the part only...I don't want a Yammy dealership touching my bike.

Anybody just gotten a part on a recall refusing labor to actually fix the potential problem...

I may as well get a new TBS at this point no matter what happens or what the problem is...

thanx Fred & everyone

Mike

You may or may not be able to get just the part from the dealership unde rthe recall. That depends entirely on the dealership. I'm also not sure why you are so concerned about having a shop replace the TPS. Just tell then to do the recall and that is all, nothing more. It really is a very minor, non-invasive procedure. So easy even a caveman could do it.

But I'd want to know if that the TPS is what your problem is before throwing the TPS in there. You do not want to introduce new parts into a system that is already having problems unless you think it will resolve them.

If your current problem isn't the TPS, just wait until after you get it running right before you put a new one in.

If i am not wrong and i wish i am wrong perhaps the problem coming from the ECU itself.The ECU adjust the injector and ignition timing after she receives signals from crankshaft sensor,cylinder sensor and other sensors.I believe firstly have a check in the injector plugs if they do good contact,have a look and in their wires and if someone is near you with a Gen 1 bike you could install his ECU in your bike and try again.But have a look and in the two ignition coils with a multimeter if they are in the specific range..but idon't believe this much..99 to 100% THIS PROBLEM IS NOT COMING FROM THE TPS!!I see the two spark plugs they have problem,they look like brand new.If you can and if you have the normal NGK spark plugs install them in the bike and give her a try first,but i don't believe it much..but you try and this,have a check in the crankshaft sensor and cylinder sensor by a multimeter if they are in the specific range..These sensors give info in the ECU and from this info the ECU adjust the injector timing giving fuel in injector per injector..

The two spark plugs looks like in their cylinders goes very very lean mixture or nothing mixture!

TBS replacement on his bike is not a minor procedure. To lift the tank, a lot of stuff has to be yanked off the handlebars. We went through that a few months ago here at my house, and even taking notes we got it wrong going back together, and something didn't go back until we figured out the incorrect sequence we were using. Three of us!

A dealership would look at the accessory wiring and say, "Well, there's your problem, right there!" and not really do anything else about it.



Basically, there aren't a lot of folks he would trust with messing with this stuff.

wfooshee said:

TBS replacement on his bike is not a minor procedure. To lift the tank, a lot of stuff has to be yanked off the handlebars. We went through that a few months ago here at my house, and even taking notes we got it wrong going back together, and something didn't go back until we figured out the incorrect sequence we were using. Three of us!
A dealership would look at the accessory wiring and say, "Well, there's your problem, right there!" and not really do anything else about it.

Basically, there aren't a lot of folks he would trust with messing with this stuff.

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Unbelievable picture!Too many farkles..but i really like it!!

i am very curious in which area is the problem..I wish that is a minor problem..

ok, plugs back in...I marked them so same plugs into same cylinder

crank it up with tank still up

it backfires, makes a lot of noise, but I've never had it running with tank up and no insulation blanket under there

it starts with a twist of throttle, and then sets to fast idle, then a bar or two goes to low idle at 1100rpm

I seem to hear a rattle, but don't know what to compare it to

I just let it run for 60-90 seconds...low idle it still runs pretty steady

so then I twist throttle and really hear a loud rattle and it kicks into the bad running...no idle...only barely runs at 2k or above rpm

I few more twists to keep it running and the noise is loud...I kill it and check diag for TBS...tests normal

So I get brave and crank it up again...runs bad, no idle, and I set the throttlemeister to 2500 rpm

Rattle, Scraping sound...louder in sync with rpm...right side of engine, and I think something with cam chain which I remember is on the right side

it really sounds scary at 5k or 6k rpm...shut it down and come here to post

yikes

Sounds like it's time to double check that CCT installation. Maybe the chain has gone slack and jumped a tooth?

Keep looking.

Al.

Lot's off conversation above, but it sounds now like you need to pull the valve cover and check the cam chain.

Backfiring could be cam timing off. Cam timing off, would be rough running cause if it is off. We don't know that, but pulling the valve cover is the only way to know.

You don't remember hearing such noises before, when it was on the road?

I know you've heard the cam chain rattle before, so I assume this is a different sound?

I'm not sure where to go now except to trailer it to your man and have him look it over.

From your earlier description of what happened on the trip home that day, the symptom was sudden, not something that built up and faded in over time. The chain skipping a tooth would be sudden like that.

****, I hope you're not the first double-grenade. Geez, Mike.

On the bright side, it's still running. And other users have reported one-tooth-off timing and been fine after correcting it.

BTW, don't run it any more until the cam timing has been checked and the tensioner has been verified as OK. Goes without saying, I hope.