Clutch operation changed on '06

Constant Mesh · May 21, 2006

The clutch slave hydraulic cylinder on the side of the engine has changed for '06. This might explain why the clutch seems different.

'05 & earlier

Master Cylinder ID = 14 mm

Slave Cylinder ID = 33.6 mm

Slave Cylinder Surface Area = 887 sq.mm

'06

Master Cylinder ID = 14 mm

Slave Cylinder ID = 29.6 mm

Slave Cylinder Surface Area = 688 sq.mm

The master cylinder on the handlebar is unchanged. But, the slave cylinder has a smaller diameter and area.

With this change you'll experience a faster acting clutch -- the '06 clutch actuating rod moves 29 % farther for equal movement of the master cylinders. Since the rod moves farther faster, the hand clutch requires a shorter, harder pull -- the on/off characteristic.

Geezer · May 21, 2006

Sounds like the change may be in deference to the auto clutch models. Anybody know if the slave cylinder is the same on both '06 models?

Fred H. · May 21, 2006

I can attest that the clutch feels a bit stiff as well as a limited engagment travel range.

I can also tell you I don't like the new progressive throttle plate setup that makes small throttle changes at low RPMs result in larger throttle plate movement. It makes the bike jerky and hard to control. What was Yamaha thinking when they did this anyway???

NovaFlyer · May 24, 2006

It makes the bike jerky - Fred H

Ok ... I'm glad it's not just me then. I find the 06 a twitchy bike in the first 3 gears. My wife's FZ6 isn't twitchy at all so I know yamaha can build a bike that isn't .... <_<

I'm going to try the throttle spring adjustment this afternoon and tighten up the throttle play to minimize the extranious throttle movement.

I'll let you know if that helps the 'jerkiness'

NFlyer

jwit6 · May 24, 2006

Nice research Constant Mesh. Makes sense. Does the 03-05 slave cylinder fit the 06?

jwit6 · Nov 8, 2006

Just replaced my 06 slave cylinder with the larger diameter 04/05 part number 5JW-16381-00-00 .

Lever pull is noticably reduced. Crotchrocket.com $58.89 and 10.95 shipping. Test ride in the morning.

Mogambo · Nov 9, 2006

I don't find it twitchy at all. The earlier engagement of the clutch was something I had to get used to (took essentially one or two rides to do this), but no twitchiness. I just thought I should add this to the conversation. I know there are folks that think their bike is twitchy, my experience with my bike is that it is not. Why this is I have no explanation for. They should be consistent but apparently they are not.

Earlier bikes experienced reports that some were fire dragon's to ride in hot weather while some rider's had no issue with the heat at all. Some bikes ticked, most did not. Why the difference? I have no idea, but these are the facts that we have all read about and experienced personally. There are differences in bikes.

jwit6 · Nov 9, 2006

Works perfectly. The 04/05 slave cylinder when installed on the o6 , provides the broad span of engagement and reduced lever pressure that I remember from my 04. Worth every penny of the 70 bucks it cost me to retrofit.

Bike Effects · Nov 9, 2006

After having an '03 and then riding an '06 I would do this in a heart beat.

jwit6 · Nov 9, 2006

Next thing to fix is the non linear throttle cam issue. Fred H went with a piece of 14 guage copper wire wrapped around the throttle body cable spool. It works, but it's not symetrical. Same effect could be had by modifying the curve on the throttle grip spool. And there is a product that might fit. It's called the G2 Ergonomics Throttle Cam System. www.g2ergo.com . See page 26 of the December Cycle World.

warsw · Nov 10, 2006

jwit6 said:
Next thing to fix is the non linear throttle cam issue. Fred H went with a piece of 14 guage copper wire wrapped around the throttle body cable spool. It works, but it's not symetrical. Same effect could be had by modifying the curve on the throttle grip spool. And there is a product that might fit. It's called the G2 Ergonomics Throttle Cam System. www.g2ergo.com . See page 26 of the December Cycle World.

I really like your idea for modifying the throttle spool. I have not had the spool off my fjr. Do you know if the fjr throttle spool is built where this type of mod might work? I have had many dirt bike throttles apart and I think that any one of them could have been modified, if desired. Is the fjr similar?

markjenn · Nov 10, 2006

Fred H. said:
I can also tell you I don't like the new progressive throttle plate setup that makes small throttle changes at low RPMs result in larger throttle plate movement. It makes the bike jerky and hard to control. What was Yamaha thinking when they did this anyway???

I don't know for sure, but I would be surprised if the progressive throttle has anything to do with RPMs. Typically this would require some kind of throttle-by-wire - that's coming (it's on the new R6 and R1), but not yet.

The way these progressive systems are typically set up is to have the first part of throttle movement affect a smaller throttle opening than the later parts. That is, when you twist the throttle from 0% to 25%, the plates may only open 0%-10%. Likewise when you go from 75%-100%, the plates may go from 50% to 100%. This makes the engine softer and easier to modulate at the small throttle openings used in low-speed maneuvering. It shifts finer control in the areas where finer control is needed and where you spend the most time. You'd be amazed how much time a big bike like the FJR stays at 5% throttle or less. And how 25% throttle will get you over 100 mph.

It sounds to me like the big problem with the new bike is the heavier return springs which Yamaha felt was necessary for safety reasons.

- Mark

jwit6 · Nov 11, 2006

Well I asked the tech at g2ergo about using one of thier throttle tubes on the FJR and they said they had already done it. Here's thier reply...

Hi,

"I have just the thing for you! Actually the VERY first FJR that I

put a TCS on lives in Slovia which is a country by Yugoslavia. He was an

excellent tester and we even talked on the phone a few times. If you get the

tube that I make for a street bike and my #400Y cam it will make your bike

PERFECT! I will guarantee it 100% and it will fit in your stock housing, NO

OTHER MODIFICATIONS!...Sam"

Constant Mesh · Nov 11, 2006

The throttle cam profile is not progressive. It's actually the opposite of progressive, maybe could be called counter-progressive.

In a progressive tax rate system the marginal tax rate increases as income level increases. In other words the slope of the curve is steeper for higher levels of income.

From this analogy the throttle cam is the opposite of progressive. If you plot a curve of throttle butterfly percent open versus throttle grip percent open (throttle valve on vertical axis and throttle grip on horizontal axis) the slope of the curve will be at its maximum at lower throttle grip positions.

At lower throttle grip openings the rate of change of the throttle valve opening is exaggerated. As the throttle is opened more and more the rate of change decreases.

Seems to be just the opposite of what would be desirable. Someone must have concluded that the FJR was too subdued at low throttle positions. So they exaggerated the throttle control, giving the rider more bang for the buck for small changes in throttle position.

I wonder if this may have changed again on the '07s? One might hope so.

shokdimn · Nov 11, 2006

Jwit6,

Sounds like Sam is brimming with confidence. Am curious to know whether or not you decided to give it a try?

Also, to you and Constant Mesh, thanks for sharing your discoveries in this thread. Its been an informative read.

jwit6 · Nov 11, 2006

Just ordered it. Shipping Monday. Gave me a full money back guarantee. Sam says "....it

is made of 6061 aluminum and so is the cam. The tube costs $39.95, the cam is

$20.00 and the freight will be $4.05. ($64.00)." He has an impressive clientel. Doug Henry, Pridmore, Jordan, and Honda race teams. Says he just signed a deal with Lockhart. Street bike versions are not on the web site yet, so you have to call in to order. 815-718-5860 if you're feeling adventurous.

warsw · Nov 11, 2006

jwit6 said:
Just ordered it. Shipping Monday. Gave me a full money back guarantee. Sam says "....itis made of 6061 aluminum and so is the cam. The tube costs $39.95, the cam is

$20.00 and the freight will be $4.05. ($64.00)." He has an impressive clientel. Doug Henry, Pridmore, Jordan, and Honda race teams. Says he just signed a deal with Lockhart. Street bike versions are not on the web site yet, so you have to call in to order. 815-718-5860 if you're feeling adventurous.

Thanks jwit6 for doing all the leg work. I just got off the phone with Sam (nice guy). He gave me all the same info as you. I now have one on the way. It is going out Monday as well.

Thanks again

shokdimn · Nov 11, 2006

Hope that turns out to be “blue-chip”! Looking forward to hearing about it.

jwit6 · Nov 16, 2006

Received the throttle grip tube and cam today. Installed it and took a test ride. It's a perfect fix. Throttle response is smooth and predictable. Plenty of throttle available if you crank it on, but very controlled and discreet at small openings. Slow speed maneuvers are a breeze. Also a noticable decrease in the amount of effort required to hold the throttle open at cruising speeds. The reshapped cam profile provides a welcome mechanical advantage over the throttle body return springs. No need for Fred's fix, no need to remove a return spring.

Combined with the clutch slave cylinder retrofit, the bike takes on a silky refined feel again. Nice tight trans, no perceived drive line slop. Smooth imperceptible 1st/2nd/3rd gear shifts. Just the way it's supposed to be.

For those with the ability, you could save some bucks and reshape the existing throttle tube to match the G2 Ergonomics #400 cam yourself. But it's so easy to just bolt up their stuff and go. So all the whining about the 06 throttle and clutch can be fixed for less than $140.00. To me it was worth every penny.

Once I get the seat squared away this one is gonna be a keeper.

Clutch operation changed on '06

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