Are more expensive Motorcycle Helmets really any safer?

[ionbeam]

^^^^^ Man, we can play Hud games all day.

Best yet, they can come SNELLed and DOTed depending on what you want to have painted.

 

[Uncle Hud]

With all due respect, Professor, would that be Snell and DOT certified by Chinese manufacturers? Because I could spring for a football helmet .... though not from Deeeetroit.

 

[GPRIDER]

I like my Shoei Helmets. Crash tested the first one. Just a few scratches. They fit me great. Airflow could be better. I'll pay the extra to be satisfied with what's on my head.

GP

 

[Fred W]

To close the loop on this thread, the reason I was asking the original question was that safety of a helmet is the foremost consideration. Some of the secondary benefits that owners of the more expensive brands brought up in the discussion were things that I knew of, but may not have put enough consideration into.

In the end, I could not locate an example of the low priced Scorpion helmet that I wanted to buy. I had had pretty good luck with my last Scorpion lid, but the reviews indicated that the head shape and sizing of the new Scorpions have changed. I had no problem finding a retailer that had lots of Shoei helmets on the shelf (at full list prices and limited selection of colors). But I was easily able to determine that I am a size "L" with no special fitments or adjustments required.

So I placed an order with my current favorite online retailer of riding gear, Revzilla, and 3 days later a new white (because you pay more for other colors that are less visible) Shoei Neotec is on my gear shelf. It does have a lot going for it, and the fit and feel is quite exquisite. I was able to fit it up for my archaic Starcom1 Advance comms system with very little trouble, and I'm looking forward to many good years of use with the new skid lid.

Yeah, it was about twice what I was prepared to pay for a crash helmet at the outset, but I realized in another thread (about seats) that I was not considering enough of the variables that make an object valuable. If it lasts for the entire 5 year warranty I'll be money ahead. Besides, I ride my motorcycles for enjoyment only. So anything that increases that enjoyment has an amplified value for me. The safety may be the same as a less expensive one. But that is not the only variable to be considered here.

Thanks to everyone that voiced their opinions. Ride safe and have fun!

 

[russperry]

There is another, older, US based study that showed that many DOT only helmets were actually safer in normal street use than the Snell rated helmets because the type of impacts you expect on the street (head falling to hit street from the bike) are different that the type of testing Snell was doing then for racing applications, where they are attempting to protect from hitting things other than the ground at speed. But you would pay more for the Snell rating, and those helemts all charged a lot more money than just the Snell rating added.
Why do these "big name" helmets command such higher prices? It certainly goes without saying that it does not cost them that much more to manufacture them. And the UK study indicates that it has nothing to do with increased safety. So why do they get so much more money for helmets of comparable comfort and convenience features, and possibly even worse safety ratings? Because they can. Because of the premise in the line re-quoted from above:

Most of you guys are probably old enough to have been riding when this report came out. It was run by Motorcyclist magazine in 2005 and was very incendiary. Basically they wrote off the Snell rating as too hard (as Fred referenced), but Arai and Shoei branded their stuff as being superior because it met the Snell rating instead of the "weaker" DOT rating which was the foundation of their premium pricing. The way I remember it, the testing and the published results basically cost Dexter Ford his job - Arai and Shoei cut off advertising with Motorcyclist and he became the fall guy. He was accused of all kinds of nefarious motives and was removed.

Of course the new Snell rating system that came out a couple of years afterward (I think it was the Snell 2010 spec that had the new test conditions) was very close to the original DOT system which preferred lower ultimate strength and G absorption over the very tough and non-flexing Snell test, so their story and findings were actually accepted and institutionalized even though they were demonized at the time of publishing.

I've not looked up that story recently (gonna check Google next) but I recall that a helmet from Z1R was declared the victor with a price of something like $80, while the very hard and expensive helmets (that translated a lot of G to your brain) from Arai and Shoei were the losers.

Sorry for the long winded response, but bottom line was that at least in the '05 to '09 era, the harder more expensive Arai and Shoei helmets were judged to be much less protective than the cheapie ones designed to the DOT standard. Seems to be no longer relevant now that all of the specs (Snell 2010, ECE22.05 and DOT) are similar.

https://motorcycleinfo.calsci.com/Articles/MotorcyclistHelmets.html Article published in 2009 in New York Times

https://jalopnik.com/5582380/how-the-truth-about-motorcycle-helmets-got-a-journalist-fired Story on the background to Ford's firing

 

[Redfish Hunter]

I just happen to have the June 2005 issue of Motorcyclist here on my desk. It has the first part of the 2 month article titled Blowing the Lid Off. Dexter was a good writer and Brian Catterson was the editor at that time. Catterson was, and is, worse than useless.

 

[RaYzerman19]

Happy for you Fred, I think you made the right choice. The Neotec feels great every time I put it on.

 

[BigOgre]

I will offer one piece of advice with this helmet though. DO NOT spend time on dusty roads with it right after applying fresh silicone lube to the shield mechanisms.

 

[Fred W]

:lol: Sorry.

I will tell you now (after the fact) that I was a little surprised that you showed up last week with your brand-y new helmet on to ride 2 days of dirt roads, but was glad to hear your take on the helmet.

Normally I am the guy following the leader, so I know it can get quite dusty back there, and usually end up dropping way back for better air. But its also one reason that I have a different (cheaper) dual sport helmet for the dirty days. That yellow Bilt DS helmet got dunked in the bottom of a drainage ditch earlier this year. Wouldn't want to have done that with a nice new street helmet. :nono:

 

[Redfish Hunter]

The Neotec is a nice lid. It is the most expensive helmet I ever bought but Dad and I both have one now. Since I keep the Cardo on that helmet but I only use it when I ride with Dad, I bought myself an "everyday, ride to work helmet". I chose a Nolan full face because I like the way it fits, I like the quality, and I LOVE the latch mechanism on the chin strap. Since I commute on the bike 98% of the time, this helmet gets used a lot but for relatively short distances and times.

When I switch to the Neotec...AAAHHHH! The Neotec is just, it's just better. Better Venting, Better Everything. I cannot explain it but it is and you know it when it happens.

 

[mophead]

Having ridden for the last 47 years of my life there have been many changes in helmets and everything else on the planet also. For many years I have ridden the Arai long oval shape because that is how my head is shaped. After being on the bike for multiple days, as many of us do, it fits, is lightweight, vents well, and I can wash the interior when it gets smelly. My son has a Shoei RF something and he loves it for the same reasons. Bought a V65 Magna once upon a time and it came with a Bell full face helmet. A friend and I immediately took off to Toas, NM, for those of you who were at that rally, and rode for a couple of days. That helmet was heavy, too large, and was generally a pain in the neck.

Since then I have opted for the comfort of something that fits properly and is suitable for long days in the saddle. I do try and catch them changing model years and styles to try and save a few bucks but in the end comfort wins.

Oh, and if you really want to test the venting system on your lid, take it out on a 40 degree day and open the vents. You will have your answer pretty quick.

 

[Uncle Hud]

Got a Neotec a few months ago, by accident, really. LOVE IT. It meets the three criteria: comfortable for hours on end, vents well, and is reasonably lightweight. (No helmet is quiet.) It gets the capital-letter rating of LOVE IT because it came with the Pinlock® shield (that's at least a $50 add), and it has the fighter-pilot sunglass visor on the inside.

The fighter-pilot visor is an incredible convenience for those of us that wear glasses. I cannot tell you how much nicer it is to flip the thing up and down, rather than debate stopping to switch between regular glasses and prescription sunglasses. It also is convenient to ride with the clear visor up, and the jet-fighter visor down. Lets in grit and bugs -- a few -- but lets in massive cubic feet of air.

 

[Gary F]

When asking my first dealer about the price of helmets, he replied if you have a 5 dollar head put it in a 5 dollar helmet. What does that say about helmetless riders?

 

[Kitt190]

Have a Kabuto Ibuku, my first modular, bought in the USA, love it, picked up a second helmet due to being out here in Japan means I'm constantly on my scooter and I sweat a LOT in 85+ with high humidity in the summer (still hot, cooling down finally) and the need to air out the helmets is strong. I now have a Shoei Neotec, Love them BOTH, and both have the inner drop down sun visor, and both are great leaving the front visor opened, both came with the pin lock, and the Ibuki is half a pound (ish) lighter but the chin vent is next to useless.

Funny thing is, the Ibuki has the DOT stickers on it(bought in the states and all that) but the Shoei (bought out here in Japan) does not, even though I KNOW this is a DOT rated lid can anyone speak on the legality of using it in the States?

 

[Bill Lumberg]

Nolan modulars fit my head, and I love the modular feature, pinloc, and flip down shade. Weight and safety are paramount in helmet choice, but those creature features (pinloc, flipdown visor) are very nice.

 

[Bugman]

6D helmets are in the news a lot lately. They have a unique system thats different from other helmets. Here is a review https://ridermagazine.com/2016/06/16/6d-ats-1-helmet/ that talks about it.

 

[HotRodZilla]

$895 for a black carbon fiber 6D ATS-1. That's 'spensive boys and girls.

 

[Kitt190]

Unless it's $300 more comfy, noticably safer (full lab tests and other lab corroberations) and still modular (I love the modular)? I'm ok with the Shoei and Kabuto.