Battery Tender Lithium battery?

[superfuzz]

Anyone familiar with this battery? Comments? Concerns?

I think it would be nice to remove some of the weight of a standard battery from up high in the fairing as it is. Plus the smaller dimensions might also be a plus as I have a couple of pigtails installed on the stock battery that I have to cram under the cover....

https://www.amazon.com/Battery-Tender-BTL14A240C-Lithium-Phosphate/dp/B00F9LPJ8S/ref=au_pf_ss_1?ie=UTF8&Make=Yamaha%7C1210&Model=FJR1300A%20ABS%7C17594&Year=2006%7C2006&carId=001&n=15684181&s=automotive

 

[ionbeam]

I think you are on your own on this.

 

[ahchiu]

I would think you would have the same problems with cold weather starts that the Shorai are having.

 

[David Foley]

I wish someone would try one of these, preferably during this next polar vortex - the colder the better, and report back

I could sure use the extra space in the fairing.

 

[garyahouse]

I would think you would have the same problems with cold weather starts that the Shorai are having.

I disagree... well sort of. Don't shoot me Alchiu. Shorai has made some serious improvements as of late. Their cold weather starting has come a long way in the past two years. I can not speak however, for the improvements that this other battery maker may have made. Shorai runs their own show in a highly competitive market. I doubt that they would sell their technology or improvements they have made... to their competitors. However, be warned. You need to read up on our testing of lithium iron batteries. I would not automatically assume that this battery is as good as a Shorai, nor would I recommend you go out and buy ANY lithium battery without reading up on what this forum has said about them.

For the latest generation of Shorai's, I would not recommend trying to count on them to start an FJR below 32 degrees. I am confident that my FJR will start at that temperature with my Shorai, and probably even a little colder as well. It never got that cold this winter, so I couldn't test below that. As I've documented, the Shorai will do MUCH better if it's on a battery tender all night... than it will when it just sits in the bike all night without a charger on it. It does make a difference when ya go to start it first thing in the morning at those colder temps. My latest efforts confirmed that the Shorai will indeed start my FJR on the first try without a battery tender at 34 degrees. Below that, ya roll the dice. I have found that the Shorai will start the bike on subsequent attempts if it will not do so on the first attempt: it gets stronger as it "wakes up" from repeated starting attempts. Also, you won't hear this from many sources, but the oil in your bike DOES indeed have an effect on how fast your engine turns over at that temperature. FWIW, I use synthetic 5w30 oil in my FJR.

Shorai testing here: CLICKY

Gary

darksider #44

Gary

 

[ahchiu]

I'm glad Shorai has made improvements, when did they start making the new ones and how will we know if we get the latest generation. I'm still waiting for more positive reports before I run out to get one, I often ride in the Winter with temps below freezing and would hate to have problems on the road.

 

[RaYzerman19]

Agree with you Gary that if plugged into a tender, the Shorai is already woken up and ready for action..... my concern would be if on the road and not plugged in.

 

[Spud]

Some trade-offs make sense, some don't. Tire doesn't grip quite as well, but lasts longer, tank bag doesn't hold much, but doesn't get in the way...etc.

To spend more $$ than the OEM replacement Yuasa, to gain a little space and lose a little weight, with the downside being that YOUR BIKE MAY NOT START is a compromise that is way off the chart for me. I've done a lot of early/late season rides where my bike sat all night in a parking lot in sub-freezing temps. I need to know it's going to fire in the AM.

My OEM went from 2008-13 and never gave me concern. I put another Yuasa in there, and should be good to go until 2018.

 

[escapefjrtist]

Agree with you Gary that if plugged into a tender, the Shorai is already woken up and ready for action..... my concern would be if on the road and not plugged in.

This ^^^^ is again my concern. For those of us that don't live in year around warm climates, these batteries aren't ready for prime time.

YMMV

--G

 

[RichDoyle]

I'll just reiterate my tests of the EarthX LiFe battery in cold weather, which appear elsewhere on this site. No observed cold-weather problems down to 24 degF and lots of starts just barely above freezing. No "warming up" by failed starting attempts so far. Just push the starter button and it fires right up at all temperatures I've tried it so far. More than 7-1/2 pounds lighter than the OEM.

I had an older Shorai on my NT which wasn't satisfactory. But we're talking 2 years ago, and apparently they've improved their product. I haven't heard boo about these new batteries from Deltran.

I can't speak directly to longevity, as these things are very new. Yep, it's bleeding edge, but I've got blood to spare. No wounds yet.

 

[garyahouse]

I'm glad Shorai has made improvements, when did they start making the new ones and how will we know if we get the latest generation. I'm still waiting for more positive reports before I run out to get one, I often ride in the Winter with temps below freezing and would hate to have problems on the road.

The Shorai in my FJR was delivered around November 2013. It is the latest generation. I provided a link to my Shorai testing thread in post #5 above. I tested three different batteries all together. The first was their 14ah. The second was their 18ah, both purchased in the late fall of 2012. The third was the one I have now, delivered in November. Their improvements are ongoing. I have no problem riding in temps below freezing because it's always in the morning when I leave for work, and the bike's in the garage. It starts fine. I always take it to school where I work, and there it sits until a much warmer afternoon. Gotta love Florida for that. My cold weather testing was done on purpose with the bike sitting outside the garage on those occasional cold nights - for the benefit of this forum. The battery works fine for me because of where I live and how I ride. I appreciate it's lighter weight. Ha - makes up for the extra weight I've put on lately. However, I would not want to drive it and park it in sub freezing temps, hoping it would start. It can indeed do it, but just barely. It will NOT start the bike at 24 degrees on the first attempt, like Rich Doyle says about his EarthX battery. For me, it's really all about just how cold it will be in the parking lot at work when I get out after 9 hours... that number is NEVER below 50 here.

Hope that helps.

Gary

 

[Harald]

For me, it's really all about just how cold it will be in the parking lot at work when I get out after 9 hours... that number is NEVER below 50 here.

Gary

NEVER? I seem to remember one particular day in Daytona Beach in the mid 80's while attending college on my '78 GS750 where the temp started out around freezing and kept dropping as the day progressed. I was VERY glad to have that snowmobile suit on my unfaired motorcycle (and a standard lead/acid battery)!

Added on edit: Entire quote above is by Gary (Damn software won't let me extract Gary's quote out of Marcus' box).

 

[ionbeam]

For me, it's really all about just how cold it will be in the parking lot at work when I get out after 9 hours... that number is NEVER below 50 here.

Gary

NEVER?...one particular day...the temp started out around freezing and kept dropping as the day progressed...
Added on edit: Entire quote above is by Gary (Damn software won't let me extract Gary's quote out of Marcus' box).

Sure the software does let you extract just Gary's quote, but that is a topic for another thread

... that number is NEVER below 50 here...

If I could only ride on whole days where it was over 50º I would ride 10 just days a year.

 

[garyahouse]

For me, it's really all about just how cold it will be in the parking lot at work when I get out after 9 hours... that number is NEVER below 50 here.

Gary

NEVER? I seem to remember one particular day in Daytona Beach in the mid 80's while attending college on my '78 GS750 where the temp started out around freezing and kept dropping as the day progressed. I was VERY glad to have that snowmobile suit on my unfaired motorcycle (and a standard lead/acid battery)!

Added on edit: Entire quote above is by Gary (Damn software won't let me extract Gary's quote out of Marcus' box).

Guess I stand corrected. As the old adage goes, "Never say Never." For what it's worth, looks like our weather is warming up. Don't think we'll be seeing any more sub freezing temps till the end of the year. My Shorai's good to go for another year it appears.

Hey Rich: what to those EarthX LiFe batteries cost?

Gary

 

[RichDoyle]

The EarthX for the FJR from the manufacturer is $219.00 (yeah, yeah, lambast away - I'm so stupid it would be better that I had died at birth, blah, blah, blah), shipping included. There might be alternative resellers from which you'd get a better deal. Some notes:

The first one I got would start the bike OK, but it didn't run right and voltage regulation on the bike didn't function correctly. I contacted the manufacturer. Of course you get to talk to sales initially, but quickly was referred to an engineer, who immediately said that it sounded like the internal Battery Management System was malfunctioning. They replaced it, with shipping both ways paid for by them. The replacement battery has been fine. I already had a voltmeter installed on the bike, which showed the problem. (These are useful in any case. I've had regular old batteries fail slowly in a way that a voltmeter might have given me earlier notice than the bike just flat dying on me while riding - not starting.)

The battery case and cables on the FJR are such that you won't get any space on the top of the battery, despite its smaller size. But there will be gaps available in the front of and below it.

EarthX does make larger capacity batteries than the one they recommend for the FJR, but the case dimensions are such that they wouldn't fit into the bracket.

The ground cable on the FJR has a bend in it such that it won't bolt directly onto the negative terminal, you have to either bend that thing flat or put a brass spacer of some sort underneath the cable terminal to get it to clear.

 

[HotRodZilla]

You guys know that the only thing a battery does is start the bike...Right? They're not magical, won't make you go faster, won't make girls like you more and won't make you a better lover, but will start your bike, most of the time.

$219 for a battery that didn't work and had to be replaced? $180 for a battery that won't start in the cold? $99 or less will get a sealed, maintenance free battery that has proven reliable over a number of years. They last as long, if not longer than the newest greatest thing that barely works.

I know, "But the new batteries are way lighter." IT IS A 650LB 128 HORSE BIKE. 8lbs is not going to matter. It won't fly into space, and none of you are going to win the next MotoGP on this or any other bike.

It shouldn't bug me cuz it's not my money. It does bug me though because I can't believe people are so foolish. Makes me wonder sometimes.

 

[RichDoyle]

You guys know that the only thing a battery does is start the bike...Right? ... It shouldn't bug me cuz it's not my money. It does bug me though because I can't believe people are so foolish. Makes me wonder sometimes.

Actually, not true. Two failures I had with those $99.00 "proven" batteries:

1. The battery (old-style vented lead acid) in my '75 Gold Wing would drive the water out of the electrolyte at a rapid rate when driven in ambient temperatures above 80 degF. This would start to expose the tops of the plates. A combination of factors caused this, but what would happen is the bike would still start fine, but the gas mileage dropped from its normal 40 MPG to like 32, and the bike lost power so severely that it wouldn't go over 80 MPH. I'd have to stop, get some distilled water, refill the cells and all would be well. If driven all day like this I'd have to fill sometime during the day and then again that evening after shutting down.
2. My ST1100 battery (sealed - 3 years old) failed while I was driving in downtown Seattle. While I was driving the bike just flat quit. I thought it had to be the charging system, but that wasn't it. Just replacing the battery cured the problem.

One other data point: My SL350 K1 didn't have an electric starter. You kick-started it. I had the bright idea to simply remove the battery, since I did a fair amount of dirt-riding with it and it got dropped from time to time. Without the battery installed I could start it, but it wouldn't rev. So the battery was required for proper functioning of the ignition system, primitive as it was.

And it is my money. Get over it. I also own an airplane. The battery for that airplane costs $600.00 and isn't expected be useful beyond 5 years, even though it's the same "proven technology" as the $99.00 bike battery. I'm perfectly willing to be an early adopter. I used to actually be derided by some for owning 4-stroke motorcycles, since they were "so complicated" compared to 2-strokes.

 

[GalaxyBlue]

Still happy with my MotoBatt i bought a couple years ago. The battery competition is a good thing for us. I'm not opposed to trying new stuff. It keeps the joy of tinkering on the bike fun!

So, Someone buy this thing, And give us a report back in a couple years!

 

[ionbeam]

You guys know that the only thing a battery does is start the bike...Right? They're not magical, won't make you go faster...$219 for a battery...
I know, "But the new batteries are way lighter."...

It shouldn't bug me cuz it's not my money. It does bug me though because I can't believe people are so foolish...

Ya know, I'd think a feller could take one of those whiz-bang LiFe batteries and put 'er under the seat and repurpose all that space in the fairing. Or, leave the old fashion PbSO4 in the faring and add a LiFe under the seat or in the tail as a secondary electrical system or supplemental electrical system. If'in ya got a whiz-bang newfangled gizmo ya havta learn how to play with it. Imagineering is priceless.