Bike running one bar lower on temp gauge

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I have posted previously about bleeding the brakes on the 2013 model as I was contemplating buying one (I did NOT own one at the time). The answer I got was a smart ass one that I should buy the manual for I bike I don't even own. WTF???

Of course some others jumped on that and NO ONE was able to answer the question.

That's fine if you don't know the answer, I still don't, but that posted answer was absolutly unnecessary and uncalled for.

Scott,

You peeked my curiosity, and I did not recall the thread that you bring up, so I had to delve into your old posts to go find this.

Worth noting is that the person (admin) in that thread who was the most abrasive is not even participating in this forum anymore.

Of course, this is still the interwebs, and you do have to maintain a little skin thickness to play here.

PS - You are definitely an "in" guy, IMO. Anyone who contributes as much as you have over the years is inner than in.

Yes Fred, that was the thread...

And yes, thick skin is needed here. IMHO, shouldn't be but that's the way it is, (don't like it, don't visit)...

And BTW, you are one of the most knowledgable folks I was referring to and don't polk at folks just for a laugh.

I always wanted to ask, there was a Fred on a Goldwing forum who also was very, very knowledgable re the Wing. Was/is that you as well??

 

[ionbeam]

I always wanted to ask, there was a Fred on a Goldwing forum who also was very, very knowledgable re the Wing. Was/is that you as well??

I believe that was Fred Harmon (Fred H), another victim of this Forum. Fred had lots of ideas to make things better for the FJR. Unfortunately some of the Forumites dog piled him for some of his ideas. Fred offered some good band-aids including a copper wire shim to fix the Gen II non-concentric pulley. A few Forumites felt Fred was fixing things that weren't broken. Some things don't have to be completely broken to create a situation that *some* people have to take abnormal care to prevent Bad Things from happening.

 

[TownsendsFJR1300]

I always wanted to ask, there was a Fred on a Goldwing forum who also was very, very knowledgable re the Wing. Was/is that you as well??

I believe that was Fred Harmon, another victim of this Forum. Fred had lots of ideas to make things better for the FJR. Unfortunately some of the Forumites dog piled him for some of his ideas. Fred offered some good band-aids including a copper wire shim to fix the Gen II non-concentric pulley. A few Forumites felt Fred was fixing things that weren't broken. Some things can not be completely broken, yet create a situation that *some* people have to take abnormal care to prevent Bad Things from happening.

Too bad, Thank you....

 

[jpcfjr]

I certainly have a thick skin but when I see bullshit I'm gonna call it out. I carefully read each post regarding my cooling issue and scanned for relevant data. However, I can only look through MY eyes. Sometimes from my perspective (which is uniquely mine) I do not see the relevance of a post. Ever heard of paradigms? We all have them. For instance in my cooling system paradigm there was no acceptance of a thermostat failing open. Why? Because I'd never seen it before so naturally I was skeptical. This is based on empirical knowledge. It's a human thing...try to understand.

However, I did NOT criticize this advice or suggestion. Go up and look if you wish. I only criticized the bullshit. The bullshit was "don't worry about it" and I partially criticized the "thermostats are designed to fail open" because that is untrue. If someone provides advice that I do not agree with I simply thank them and move on. No issue. But don't bring the bullshit to me because I'm gonna call you on it every time. I'm not some 13 year old with a new toy here. I went to engineering school and I'm a licensed professional engineer. I don't make stuff up. If I don't understand something I ask and if I have something to offer I will provide my opinion. And when I'm wrong I'll be the first one to admit it. I don't give a rats ass if anybody takes my opinion or not. Their prerogative. I don't get offended. But I would never tell anybody to not worry about something that is bothering them. That is where I left the reservation and I will every time.

Yes, my neck and back are sore today. Time for a sit in the hot tub.

 

[John d]

I always wanted to ask, there was a Fred on a Goldwing forum who also was very, very knowledgable re the Wing. Was/is that you as well??

I believe that was Fred Harmon (Fred H), another victim of this Forum. Fred had lots of ideas to make things better for the FJR. Unfortunately some of the Forumites dog piled him for some of his ideas. Fred offered some good band-aids including a copper wire shim to fix the Gen II non-concentric pulley. A few Forumites felt Fred was fixing things that weren't broken. Some things don't have to be completely broken to create a situation that *some* people have to take abnormal care to prevent Bad Things from happening.

Yup!

It's easy to be nice, and not hard to piss someone off.

Fred is now the Tech Editor at COG, and is very helpful to all.

 

[Fred W]

I only criticized the bullshit. The bullshit was "don't worry about it"

Yeah, well that was my advice, and you called me irresponsible for giving it at the time. Now you are calling it bullshit? Why? Because you didn't like the advice? That is bullshit.

Your cooling system was running perfectly normally. It was before you prophylactically replaced the thermostat. There was no drive-ability issue being caused by those perfectly normal coolant temperatures. Engines do not care a wit about a 10 degree difference in temperature.

If you want to "fix" things on your own bike that aren't actually broken you certainly have the right to do that. But do not call me irresponsible, or call what I told you bullshit, for (what turns out to have been) perfectly sane and 100% correct advice. You may not have liked my advice, because you wanted something to fix, but I was actually correct. If you had followed my advice your bike would have been perfectly fine.

 

[winewhisperer]

Lol, all for not anyway quite frankly. Got sandwiched between an Infinity G37 and a Ford Expedition this morning. $5,500 estimate with a lot of Tupperware to replace. Somehow I landed on my feet. Oh well, at least the engine is running at the right temp...

Could this be a case of bad Karma at work?

That's not all that funny...even if you try to make it so by adding a smiley face.

No, it was a bad 19 year old driver in his dad's car. Luckily I walked away without a scratch. Luckily.

Lol, all for not anyway quite frankly. Got sandwiched between an Infinity G37 and a Ford Expedition this morning. $5,500 estimate with a lot of Tupperware to replace. Somehow I landed on my feet. Oh well, at least the engine is running at the right temp...

Could this be a case of bad Karma at work?

Getting squashed in between two cars, which is a NO WIN situation, "bad Karma"? NO COMMENT

Sorry about the misunderstanding. The "Karma" was a comment upon how this entire topic went south and got entirely too personal. I would never make fun of someone's misfortune and I am glad that you escaped without any serious injuries.

I hope everything works out for you and the FJR is restored to perfect condition. Good luck to you!

 

[rushes]

So did we ever figure out if a new thermostat will fix stumbling and roughness at higher revs?

To be continued?

 

[Fred W]

So did we ever figure out if a new thermostat will fix stumbling and roughness at higher revs?To be continued?

Answer below (no)

The Thermostat appears to be the culprit. I pulled out the old one last night and while not stuck open it has a significant scraped portion on the brass inner cylinder that moves inside the spring. This shaft has been scraping against the outer bracket of the thermostat for some time.
There is no indication that this thermostat has any sort of mechanism to fail in the open position. And as I’ve mentioned, I’ve never seen or heard of such a thing. The dozen or so thermostats I’ve replaced in the last 35 years have all failed closed or failed to open fully. This one it seems failed in such a way as to scrape against the bracket when heated up and open thus closing very slowly. Just luck of the draw I guess.

Funny that I posited this scenario in my first post…then discounted it because I’d never seen this happen before. Should always go with your first answer on the test?

Based on what I saw on the dash this morning I suspect that the original thermostat was bad from day one. The temp reading on the dash went up to 4 bars and stayed there, rock steady, until I sat at a light for a while. As previously mentioned, the bike used to sit at 6 to 7 bars and hit 8 at long stops. I’m thinking it should have been at 4 all along (as the guy from England mentioned). It felt as if the bike was running smoother now too…too early to tell if that is just euphoria from fixing this issue.

Finally, please don’t ignore a change in your bike no matter what people may suggest. A change is an indicator that something is potentially wrong. If I had ignored this change, eventually the thermostat would have stuck closed and probably not at an opportune moment. And bonus, since my bike is still under warranty, I should be able to get the $42 back once I bring in the defective part.

So, what was the cause of the driveability issues that you claimed began coincidentally with the start of the more normal temp readings?

Probably coincidence.

 

[wheatonFJR]

In a situation like this the normal recommendation is never to stop dead centre and close to the vehicle in front, you don't have an exit route...........
This starts with following in the correct position - if an overtake is not on, take up an extended following position, i.e. far enough back and to one side.

If you have to stop, make sure there is an exit route. Stay in gear and be ready to take evasive action. YMMV

In a perfect world maybe...but a quicker than normal stop for all vehicles means they were all surprised somehow and couldn't plan the ending location of the bike.

I agree with your thoughts about the optimal bike position though.

 

[LAF]

"Why cant we all just get along?"

It is all good here. We are all different and have various degrees of OCD. Some of us forget our meds, some of us like WoodFord Reserve a little too much and then get on the forums.

It is just a mixing of personality's and different ways of looking at stuff.

A stuck thermostat to a wreck in the same thread is pretty different to say the least. I have OCD and stuff that happens on my bikes or cars bother me until I resolve them or discount them as "normal". It may take me a lot more steps to get there then more experienced FJR people though.

Any forum you join has it's nuances and some are a very tough room. I just bought a 13 Honda Accord Coupe and talk about a very rough room. That forum is brutal!

It takes time to get to know people and from the written words it is much harder to figure them out. I just chill and let it be. Yes I can be shitty on things I am passionate about but if someone can help me or calls me on it then it gets worked out.

I am sorry for your accident no one deserves that, period. Been there and wear all the jewelry from it. Still think you were on the right thing with the thermostat and the gauge reading, but not sure it was a drive ability issue. OCD because it was not "right" for sure and I understand that for sure.

Look forward to hearing you fixing your bike and riding again and wish you well in that part of your life right now. The rest is just static.

 

[ionbeam]

First, I'm sorry to read about your accident, that sucks big time. Also, I really glad to hear that there was no physical trauma, you were unlucky to be involved in a crash like that but you were REALLY LUCKY to have such a good outcome.

...when I see bullshit I'm gonna call it out...in my cooling system paradigm there was no acceptance of a thermostat failing open. Why? Because I'd never seen it before so naturally I was skeptical. This is based on empirical knowledge. It's a human thing...try to understand.
...I only criticized the bullshit. The bullshit was "don't worry about it" and I partially criticized the "thermostats are designed to fail open" because that is untrue...

I only criticized the bullshit. The bullshit was "don't worry about it"

Yeah, well that was my advice, and you called me irresponsible for giving it at the time. Now you are calling it bullshit? Why? Because you didn't like the advice? That is bullshit.

Your cooling system was running perfectly normally. It was before you prophylactically replaced the thermostat.

There was no drive-ability issue being caused by those perfectly normal coolant temperatures. Engines do not care a wit about a 10 degree difference in temperature....

Well, you smoked me out, I'm a bullshitter. If I was educated in motor vehicles I never would have said that the thermostat may be a fail-safe type because there aren't any, all thermostats fail closed.

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Local store.

 

[08FJR4ME]

Not bad for an Electrical Engineer.

Another known forumite with some credible knowlege.

 

[jpcfjr]

Ok, there is one example of a thermostat that fails open. You said they all do which is not true. And certainly all of the ones I've ever encountered did not. And certainly the one in the FJR was not designed to do that. So yes, I'm sure you can find an example of a bigfoot if you look hard enough. Maybe even a unicorn. Probably a bigfoot riding on the back of a unicorn...

Point is, I said I had never seen one before. I didn't say it didn't exist. I've still never actually seen one. And Honda, which makes awesome stuff doesn't put this item in their Acura TL (at least not in the '05 I have). So yes, technically you are right and I'm wrong but it still has nothing to do with the problem I experienced. Who knows, maybe there is a flying spaghetti monster too.

 

[jpcfjr]

Not bad for an Electrical Engineer.

Another known forumite with some credible knowlege.

And this credibility is based on one obscure part that is not used in anything I have ever seen or probably anybody else on this forum has ever seen. After an internet search he found a part to back up a ridiculous argument. Unreal.

How about some credible advice here. Oh I know, "don't worry about it", that's the credible advice.

 

[wheatonFJR]

Give it a rest.

Buy your new FJR.

Ride new FJR.

Be happy.

 

[Geezer]

Not bad for an Electrical Engineer.

Another known forumite with some credible knowlege.

And this credibility is based on one obscure part that is not used in anything I have ever seen or probably anybody else on this forum has ever seen. After an internet search he found a part to back up a ridiculous argument. Unreal.

How about some credible advice here. Oh I know, "don't worry about it", that's the credible advice.

Ionbeam's credibility has been built over time by his many, many correct and helpful responses to other people's complex problems on their FJRs. If it's that important to you, you can search the forum and spend many hours reading his posts to see what I mean.

The same goes for Fred_W.

I'm not saying that they are infallible, but you are not going to make your point by continuing to harp on one or two comments just because you don't agree with their perspective.

 

[LAF]

Give it a rest.
Buy your new FJR.

Ride new FJR.

Be happy.

+1

 

[ionbeam]

And this credibility is based on one obscure part that is not used in anything I have ever seen or probably anybody else on this forum has ever seen. After an internet search he found a part to back up a ridiculous argument. Unreal.
How about some credible advice here. Oh I know, "don't worry about it", that's the credible advice.

Redacted comment.

 

[jpcfjr]

I think my point was well made many posts ago.

There are many know-it-all bullies on this site. I stopped posting here several years ago as a result. This was an attempt to try again but I can see nothing has changed.

Enjoy your lovefest here and continue to drive away nice folks who could help you.

I'm out.