"Consumer Reports:" Yamaha most reliable motorcycle !

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With regard to BMW I have observed the owners are much more inclined to seek dealer repairs than FJR owners, especially during the warranty period. While we have many competitive sources for parts and service, BMW owners are much more limited as BMW tightly controls the retail and channels. The high-end bikes have a lot more complex electronics that are not mechanically serviceable and may contribute to many of the service needs.

 
AbercrombieFJR has a very valid point. I agree...my $13K FJR is worth way more to me than than a $25K Bike is going to be worth to someone making 6 figures. I couldn't agree more as to perceived value relative to income. I still can't belive I own something this awesome.

However I am still solid on my opinion.. you may not even realize the things you "let go" that others might be totally intollerant of.

Case in point... my brand new FJR stalled at least two times, every time, i went for a ride with it (like 6 rides) before I decided to turn up the idle.

Warmed up... not cold...idle was ~900 rpm... in the middle of various missions. That... is rediculous for a bike of this caliber. An inexperienced rider could have dumped the bike, and a non technical person may not have decided to turn that screw. My $4000 KLR never did that... not once, street or woods...

I turned the screw on the FJR... and am moving on with life. I didnt call the dealer, and am not likly to color in that box on the next survey i get about it.

Do you belive our freind the orthodontist would do the same with his BMW? Maybe... but it's unlikely.

I worked at a Napa store for 23 years... some people do thier own valve jobs, some people cant change a wiper blade themselves. A 19 year old stock boy thinks his 84 S10 pickup is just "The Shit", while a 45 your old Lawyer calls his wifes 2006 Porsche Cayenne "The Beater"... Like it or not... Many, many people "fit" my post above as it relates to position in life and tolerance to mechanical inadeqacies relating to devices they own.

CR is a great resource, and i LOVE thier findings (hoping im not in the 11%) But I would love to see the demographics of the survey responders included per brand.

That being said.. I am still happy I bought a Yamaha and can brag to my freinds who are riding the lesser brands about the CR findings.

 
Someone stop me... I shouldnt type that much.

I dont mean to stereotype.. my dentist, and a good freind, owns 4 rare sportscars, 2 muscle cars, and a packard... he knows more, and does more, mechanically than I will ever know. (But..he wouldnt fill out a survey either...)

 
While I'm not a huge fan of Consumer Reports methodology, I do think it shows trends.Maybe most H-D owners have the mechanical skills of a 7th grade Home Economics student and it skews the figures.

And maybe BMW owners are all skiing and playing golf and don't have time to properly fill the clutch reservoir.

But I've owned 3 Beemers and had a final drive crap out on me and never looked back.

I switched back to Japanese bikes because I don't have the time, patience or money to put up with issues which should have been dealt with years ago and could strand me in the middle of nowhere.

In this day and age, there's no excuse for poor design or manufacturing and I won't deal with it, particularly at a premium price.

I've owned my last BMW.

And I love my FJR.
+1 on Lockback's observations. I owned a 2004 BMW and will say it was a good bike but I had several quality issues. With just 900 miles on the bike the rear master cylinder developed a crack and the dealer nor BMW parts N.A. had a replacement part. They took one off a new bike on the floor. I had on going problems with the tail light bulb burning out. One side bag lock broke. Other than my BMW, one of my riding buddies has a 2005 R1200RT and the final drive blew at 70mph. The bike had 26000 miles on the clock. BMW would not cover one cent of the repair cost. The final drive has no fill or drain plugs. There is no vent tower. This is a commonly known issue with that model and BMW will not acknowledge they f***ed up. No more BMW's for me!!

 
Example.. My glovebox lid was sticky.. I fixed it. I reported it to no one... Now... If I was a busy Lawyer. and just spent $25K on a bike, I would have niether the time nor interest in fixing it myself.
If you were a lawyer, you'd probably start a class action suit for sticky glovebox lids, after taking it to the dealer, and having had your bike tied up for two weeks while they 'investigate' the issue.

But seriously, BMW riders I ride with acknowledge that bikes made in Japan, required less repairs, are more reliable, and don't let you down. While leading a group ride a few years ago, five on rental bikes, the BMW had front end braking issues, and the shifter fell off the Harley. Sample size 1 but the results were the same, and memorable.

 
The demographics of the survey are limited to people who read CR. So the results are useful to people who make decisions from reading CR. Enthusiasts read other types of mags so they may not be represented in the CR survey. They would be in a different demographic. So what type of person reads CR and what would be their expectation when buying a motorcycle? Yamaha seems to fulfill the expectations of CR type folks the best.

 
2004 Honda spirit= no problem

2004 HD Fat Boy. = Would not run right after ethanol crap, lucky to get rid of it.(lost over $40000) 2007 Yamaha Strat= no problem

2006 Yamaha fjr. = no problem

As far as I'm concerned Consumer Reports hit a home run.

 
2004 Honda spirit= no problem2004 HD Fat Boy. = Would not run right after ethanol crap, lucky to get rid of it.(lost over $40000) 2007 Yamaha Strat= no problem

2006 Yamaha fjr. = no problem

As far as I'm concerned Consumer Reports hit a home run.
You lost $40K on a FatBoy!? I think you overpaid for something!

 
One thing I noticed that has not beed addressed yet... BMW riders tend to put a lot more miles on than your average rider. This may have skewed the results as there would have been more failures due to more total miles ridden in the reporting period.

On a more personal note, I have owned two Harleys. These are the only two bikes I have bought brand new. One of the heads on the 1998 Sporty grenaded at 200 miles, and the 2007 Wide Glide would not start 1/2 the time when hot (Summer after I bought it). Extremely unlucky? Maybe. Burned twice I won't be gettin' near the HD fire again.

 
After watching my wife ride more than 80,000km on 2 different Yamaha Viragos ('85 750-'99 1100), with no problems, I felt confident buying the 2006 FJR.

Even my venerable Honda ST1100 threw a rod at 120,000km. Apparently quite unusual, according to the ST riders.

Anyway, I have confidence that the FJR will be very reliable and chose it over a BMW for some of the reasons listed in previous posts.

The FJR1300 seems like a lot of bike for the buck!

 
I've subscribed to CR for years and like their approach to getting reliablity information. I get a survey every year for info on vehicles I own and my service experience with them. I currently have 54,000 miles on my 2005 FJR and love it.

I agree with CR on this completely.

 
as I understand it, CR merely sends out surveys that folks decide whether to answer, with questions to identify what kind of vehicle (or product) was purchased within the last x amount of time, and what, if any, problems happened as judged by the owner.
stats are directly from that...they rely on survey stats and the answers to their questions...no more, no less
This!!

What many of you are overlooking is that the Consumer Reports polls are sent out to subscribers, which is already a non-representative subset and the response to it is totally voluntary.

Why is that important?

Because the only people that respond to voluntary polls are people who either have an axe to grind (failures), are completely smitten with their purchase decision (Harley and BMW riders with no axe to grind), or have no other things of interest to consume their lives (the paltry number of UJM respondents). The vast majority of people who are merely satisfied and have otherwise full lives will not respond and their non-votes go completely uncounted.

A more equitable methodology would be to count the non-responders as "passively satisfied" in the statistics. I think the numbers would change greatly.

 
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the response to it is totally voluntary.
Why is that important?

Because the only people that respond to voluntary polls are people who either have an axe to grind (failures), are completely smitten with their purchase decision (Harley and BMW riders with no axe to grind), or have no other things of interest to consume their lives (the paltry number of UJM respondents). The vast majority of people who are merely satisfied and have otherwise full lives will not respond and their non-votes go completely uncounted.

A more equitable methodology would be to count the non-responders as "passively satisfied" in the statistics. I think the numbers would change greatly.
1st off,+1 Fred. 2ndly, let me say I'm no statistician. The only reason i can spell it is with spell check.

I'm always interested in who answers a particular poll, as well as, their motivation because who and why answer skews results.

I just helped complete a survey of 3000 households in my area for our community association and we learned a lot about who answered and why, and although that population and the one in the bike survey are different, I do think there are probably a lot of similarities, especially in age.

We found that younger people were not as inclined to take time with a survey as much as older folks, even though they were asked to participate. The largest group of people that responded were 45-65. It dropped off on both sides of that age as you might expect.

In the bike survey I would expect to find the majority in the same 45-65 age group, similar to the demographics of this forum. On the forum you have the same age bracket, with an engaged group eager to participate in something they are very interested in. You get a lot of people willing to chime in when they have high interest, like this forum.

Now pardon me while i make some gross generalizations and stereotypes:

When your $25k BMW blows a gasket (or final drive), and it costs a couple $K to fix, and the company won't stand behind the over priced product it can really piss you off. Someone asks you how you feel about that, what you gonna say?
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On the other hand if your Hardley Ableson breaks down and you spend a grand having it fixed, that's nothing, because you were going to spend $2500 on chrome dingles and googah anyway, and you may feel that's the price of admission. When you're done you show all your friends the new dingles you paid sooo much for with pride cause that's what you do when you have a Hardley. And when the Wife asks why did you spend so much on the bike last month you can say "it HAD to be fixed", and "its a Harley", so your alibi is plausible.

Suzuki wasn't represented because many of those owners were out practicing their stunting and getting passengers unstuck from in between the tail and rear wheel.
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Yamaha folks like us figure shit out and fix it ourselves. I mean who does tech days better than us? Dealer, we don't need no stinking dealer.
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When someone asks you how you feel about that, you say "my bikes great, love it, no problems", reinforcing our superior choice of bike and saying, in other words, everyone else' bikes suck.
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I don't know about you but I have had more trouble free miles on my Yamaha's than on any other bikes.

I have always wrenched on my own toys, not just because I am a cheapskate, but because I'm lazy and don't want to waste time fixing what i should be riding. I have had other bikes and lusted for others but changed my mind when I found out they were, shall we say, more demanding of my time.

Lastly, I think MCN surveys on bike repairs and reliability would be more valid than CR. Might have higher response rates and cover more models, but i bet the demographics would be similar.

 
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Similar to what BWV posted, I think there is an expectation bias - if you just dropped $25K on a bike, you expect it to be perfect, so every glitch is an issue and remembered. If you have bought a mass market bike at a good discount, then a glitch is fixed and forgotten.
Sorry Riona, I have to disagree. I feel a $15,000 FJR means a heck of lot more to a poor fireman like me, than a BMW would to someone making a couple hundred thousand a year. I expect perfection for my money and every glitch is a big issue with me.
+1

 
Motorcycles that I have owned over the years (in this order):

MotoMorini 50

'71 Bronco Apache 100

'74 Suzuki TM125

hiatus to serve Uncle Sam

'75 Suzuki GT550

'84 BMW K100RT

2nd hiatus to raise 3 children

'75 Honda Elsinore MT250

'84 Suzuki RM125

'73 Suzuki TS400 Apache

'83 Honda CR480R

'86 Honda XR400R and son had XR200

'00 Ducati Monster 750

'94 BMW R1100RS

'98 Honda VFR800Fi (still have)

'01 Kawasaki Concours

'05 Yamaha FJR1300 (still have)

'05 Kawasaki KLR650

'00 Aprilia Pegaso Cube (still have)

'01 Triumph Trophy 900

'75 BMW R60/5

'04 Suzuki DL1000 V-Strom (still have)

'08 Yamaha WR250X/R

What a crazy mishmash of bikes. Guess which have been the most reliable? (hint: it's a trick question)

(I almost pulled a brain muscle remembering all of these bikes)

 
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Some thoughts/comments regarding everyone's responses. The first thing that struck me was just SEEING the article in the magazive I've subscribed to for almost 40 yrs. Obviously I'm not exactly young and my memory ain't what it used to be but I don't recall any previous articles addressing the subject. I regard it as an acknowledgement by a very respected (by most people) publication of the importance of the motorcylce market as well as the fact that we pay a lot of money for these things and as consumers need all the info we can get prior to purchase. You may poo-poo CR all you want but NO ONE else has the resources, expertise, and objectivity of CR. As stated in the original post Suzuki was omitted because there were not enough owners to be statistically significant. NO survey is going to be perfect; hell, how many presidents have been elected even though more peple voted for the other guy ? Regarding BMW owners....merely anecdotal evidence but in my experience they are some of the MOST hands on riders around. Consider that the GS (I believe) is their best selling model and my guess is that LOTS of those guys can fix a lot of problems all by themselves. I recall a not too distant Iron Butt and the BMW failure rate was absolutely atrocious ! I remember reading an aricle and could not believe the numbers. And these were bikes that you would have assumed to have been in the best possible mechanical condition.
Took the words right out of my mouth!

Sitting on the throne yesterday and opened the magazine to see a picture of a Fee-Jer. Since when does CR have an audience for this?

I'd very much agree as well that findings and ratings of their reports are useless without reading their sometimes very subjective methodology. More than once I've completely disagreed with their findings but if they put a greater degree of emphasis on a certain aspect of a product than you would, than it skews everything.

I also wasn't surprised with their findings on the reliability of BMWs vs HDs. I do recall reading that most reliability issues were a result of electrical issues isn't comparing a Beemer to a hog like comparing a Tandy to an iMac?

 
Motorcycles that I have owned over the years (in this order):
MotoMorini 50

'71 Bronco Apache 100

'74 Suzuki TM125

hiatus to serve Uncle Sam

'75 Suzuki GT550

'84 BMW K100RT

2nd hiatus to raise 3 children

'75 Honda Elsinore MT250

'84 Suzuki RM125

'73 Suzuki TS400 Apache

'83 Honda CR480R

'86 Honda XR400R and son had XR200

'00 Ducati Monster 750

'94 BMW R1100RS

'98 Honda VFR800Fi (still have)

'01 Kawasaki Concours

'05 Yamaha FJR1300 (still have)

'05 Kawasaki KLR650

'00 Aprilia Pegaso Cube (still have)

'01 Triumph Trophy 900

'75 BMW R60/5

'04 Suzuki DL1000 V-Strom (still have)

'08 Yamaha WR250X/R

What a crazy mishmash of bikes. Guess which have been the most reliable? (hint: it's a trick question)

(I almost pulled a brain muscle remembering all of these bikes)
It that all?? And to think some people here actually told me you were practically an expert.
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Motorcycles that I have owned over the years (in this order):
MotoMorini 50

'71 Bronco Apache 100

'74 Suzuki TM125

hiatus to serve Uncle Sam

'75 Suzuki GT550

'84 BMW K100RT

2nd hiatus to raise 3 children

'75 Honda Elsinore MT250

'84 Suzuki RM125

'73 Suzuki TS400 Apache

'83 Honda CR480R

'86 Honda XR400R and son had XR200

'00 Ducati Monster 750

'94 BMW R1100RS

'98 Honda VFR800Fi (still have)

'01 Kawasaki Concours

'05 Yamaha FJR1300 (still have)

'05 Kawasaki KLR650

'00 Aprilia Pegaso Cube (still have)

'01 Triumph Trophy 900

'75 BMW R60/5

'04 Suzuki DL1000 V-Strom (still have)

'08 Yamaha WR250X/R

What a crazy mishmash of bikes. Guess which have been the most reliable? (hint: it's a trick question)

(I almost pulled a brain muscle remembering all of these bikes)
It that all?? And to think some people here actually told me you were practically an expert.
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Expert at what?
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And you nobody has answered my question: Which of those bikes was the most reliable?

 
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