Fastest Tourer? FJR takes a respectable 6th place

[carlson_mn]

There comes a point where lugging an engine doesn't save gas; the throttle bodies are open so small it creates pumping vacuum that fights the cycle of the engine - and like you said you may have to achieve 85mph, where yes I'm sure 3700rpm could be sufficient as opposed to my guess of about 4500 it is at now.

Adding a 6th gear would create a larger/longer transmission, more parts, weight etc. Not a big deal but my '08 gets 48ish mpg at 70 and I doubt there would be much more to be gained there. Add in the downshifting when you pass, etc and it's understandable where the rpms sit in 5th gear. Already very similar in rpms to the Concours' 6th gear. Add in a passenger and luggage which is common with FJR and I wouldn't want it any lower. I can understand it could be nice though at certain speeds.

 

[SoCalFJR1300]

There's a guy on the other FJR site that sold his BMW to buy a FJR.

He said the maint. was killing him.

After already spending quite a bit over the life of the bike on maint/repair.........

His BMW (I think it was a 1200,not sure) needed the electronic shock suspension replaced to the tune of $3,500!!!

Also needed a clutch and was quoted $1,500.

BMW's (cars and bikes)and Mercedes cars too for that matter aren't known for having steller reliability.

I'll stick with the "less advanced" Japanese Thank You!

 

[SoCalFJR1300]

Ya...but the Feejer still looks better then your Beemer.

...And at half the price

Well correct on one anyway; the half price thingy

You guys are all stuck in the narrow minded FJR beer goggles world. When I pull up to a neutral spot with other FJR's, well I'll be nice, but clearly the attention all comes the Beemers way. It's not even a fair fight. But, wholly rollers, the price tag does suck moose balls x10!

For the price you pay it should be the greatest thing since sliced bread, but IMOP it's not THAT much better than a FJR....for the difference in price. If it makes you happy go for it.

 

[Fred W]

My take... Designers can pick whatever final drive ratio they want for top gear, regardless of if the trans has 5 or 6 gears. They pick that based on the engine's torque/horsepower curves and desired top speed. They can also pick a lowest gear ratio based on the engine torque and desired acceleration character off the line. From there, deciding what is required for intervals of gearing is entirely dependent on what the engine torque is.

In some cases even 5 gears is overkill if the engine torque is substantial. The FJR is one such case. The torque curve Is so flat on an FJR that we could quite easily get by with only 4 cogs total... But of course all those people (and motorcycle magazine reviewers who directly influence sales) with "transmission speeds envy" would never buy a modern motorcycle with only 4 speeds. The spacing would be wider that the current 5 speed' but who has ever noticed the bike lugging after a shift from 6k rpm to 5500 rpm?

Inserting additional gears only makes a machine faster that has the engine tuned for narrow, peak power. Otherwise it actually slows the vehicle down as there it's more time wasted in shifting gears. The ideal transmission (theoretically) is one that delivers maximum power while maintaining the engine rpm in the sweet spot of maximum torque' with no shifting. Like, say, a CVT or fully automatic transmission.

Is that what you want to ride?

Not me.

 

[Redfish Hunter]

My mean spirited and sarcastic opinion, even though you did not ask for it.

I could give a rat's ass if the BMW gets better fuel mileage and turns less RPM. I could really give a shit less if the BMW has one more gear. Yes, the BMW is a wonderful bike. Yes, it is pretty. Yes, the burgundy color of beemerdonS bike is fantastic. I don't want one. I don't envy, covet, or secretly wish for any of the BMW sport tourers. I don't care how good they sound on paper, they don't make me happy.

I am educated enough to understand the relationship between RPMs and friction. I have a fairly decent understanding of torque curves. I learned how to use the throttle to match engine speed/gear position/bike velocity at the age of 6. I don't think the basic principles have changed much in the last 40 years or so.

And to be completely honest, I make enough money to buy and ride pretty much whatever the hell I want to ride. If I went to buy a new bike tomorrow it would be a 2014 FJR ES. I would not consider a BMW.

If anyone thinks that I am wearing "FJR beer goggles" I wish they would go talk about it on the BMW forum. I don't like the BMW, I don't want the BMW, and I am pretty sure I am entitled to my own opinion.

If 5 gears instead of 6 is a deal breaker for someone, fine. I wish them luck. I urge them to enjoy their 6th gear and their bike. But I don't need anyone to tell me I am stupid because I don't have a 6th gear.

 

[Bounce]

Inserting additional gears only makes a machine faster that has the engine tuned for narrow, peak power. Otherwise it actually slows the vehicle down as there it's more time wasted in shifting gears.

very true in the case of the Subaru STi v WRX. While the WRX is less total power and lower top speed, the 5 speed of the WRX means it often has better 0-60 times than the STi because of the additional shift the 6 speed of the STi mandates. Like noted above, they chose to put 3 gears in the ratio of the WRX first 2.

Simply adding another gear in the transmission means less than where that gear fits in the scheme of things. A gear you can barely use unless going over 85 mph would be useless for most of their target base; who ride where speed limits are lower than that.

As for ranting about how everyone else on an FJR forum are dumb asses for owning FJRs... it seems at least a waste of time and, possibly, arrogant. It's definitely rude and impolite. Maybe you'd prefer the brie and beaujolais over on a forum dripping in agreement with your strongly held opinions?

 

[art miller]

OK folks,this topic is now settled. Your FJR and my FJR are as good as Yamaha can do. Since no one can demonstrate a more economical bike of like nomenclature we should unite and agree the 5 sp is as good as it can be.

 

[BanjoBoy]

My take... Designers can pick whatever final drive ratio they want for top gear, regardless of if the trans has 5 or 6 gears. They pick that based on the engine's torque/horsepower curves and desired top speed. They can also pick a lowest gear ratio based on the engine torque and desired acceleration character off the line. From there, deciding what is required for intervals of gearing is entirely dependent on what the engine torque is. 

In some cases even 5 gears is overkill if the engine torque is substantial. The FJR is one such case. The torque curve Is so flat on an FJR that we could quite easily get by with only 4 cogs total... But of course all those people (and motorcycle magazine reviewers who directly influence sales) with "transmission speeds envy" would never buy a modern motorcycle with only 4 speeds. The spacing would be wider that the current 5 speed' but who has ever noticed the bike lugging after a shift from 6k rpm to 5500 rpm?

 

Inserting additional gears only makes a machine faster that has the engine tuned for narrow, peak power. Otherwise it actually slows the vehicle down as there it's more time wasted in shifting gears. The ideal transmission (theoretically) is one that delivers maximum power while maintaining the engine rpm in the sweet spot of maximum torque' with no shifting. Like, say, a CVT or fully automatic transmission.

 

Is that what you want to ride?

 

Not me.

Exactly!!! I've always thought Yamaha should lower 2nd gear, 'n get rid of 1st all together; that would give the wankers at the sucky, glossy rags sumpin to talk 'bout.

'N maybe they could make the bike lighter 'n narrower ta boot?

 

[SoCalFJR1300]

As far as being blinded by "FJR goggles".

I think a statement like that refers to Harley and BMW riders MUCH more than it does FJR riders.

Riding Harleys and BMW's isn't just about riding a motorcycle,it's a "lifestyle"

Most Harley and BMW riders don't CARE how unreliable or reliable their rides are, they are dedicated to the brand no matter what!

Can't get much more "blinded " than THAT!

 

[Bounce]

While the FJR hasn't been perfect, I'm unaware of any inherent design flaw that was more than inconvenient (the rare tick or spider bite for example).

Meanwhile the hits keep coming for Bring More Wampum.

https://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/News/newsresults/General-news/2014/June/jun0514-BMWrecall/

 

[TripperMike]

I don't have anything against BMWs, or their owners for that matter. Most of those bikes are pretty descent machines for the most part.

But it is out of my price range. Oh well.

The only thing that bothers me about BMWs really is how it seems that most bike rag writers seem to be taking that BMW (and Ducati) kool-aid intravaneously.

There are a couple of Harleys that tickle my fancy as well. But for the most part, their riders bug the shit out of me. I think if HD were to dump their factories into the middle of Lake Michigan, their blind loyal customer base would dive into the middle of the lake right along side of them. Bandanas, chaps, leather vests, tractors and all. Hopefully those HD riders who have some sense wouldn't take that dive, but most of those lemmings would.

Frankly I am caring less n less about how the FJR stacks up against it's competitors in mostly meaningless magazine comparos. I absolutely love my bike and never have felt a tinge of buyer's remorse for getting it. Yesterday as the odo rolled over to 150K, I found myself remembering back to many great, and trouble free trips I have been on with Old Yellar. I am sure if I had deeper pockets, a BMW might have done the same...but I don't really care. The FJR has been a great bike.

Final note, a sixth gear would totally suck moist cheese. If the FJR gear case is anything like the V-Max, there isn't enough room for an additional gear. Meaning a sixth gear equiped FJR would have a bigger (= heavier) engine to house that extra gear.

 

[FJR Bill]

My take... Designers can pick whatever final drive ratio they want for top gear, regardless of if the trans has 5 or 6 gears. They pick that based on the engine's torque/horsepower curves and desired top speed. They can also pick a lowest gear ratio based on the engine torque and desired acceleration character off the line. From there, deciding what is required for intervals of gearing is entirely dependent on what the engine torque is.
In some cases even 5 gears is overkill if the engine torque is substantial. The FJR is one such case. The torque curve Is so flat on an FJR that we could quite easily get by with only 4 cogs total... But of course all those people (and motorcycle magazine reviewers who directly influence sales) with "transmission speeds envy" would never buy a modern motorcycle with only 4 speeds. The spacing would be wider that the current 5 speed' but who has ever noticed the bike lugging after a shift from 6k rpm to 5500 rpm?

Inserting additional gears only makes a machine faster that has the engine tuned for narrow, peak power. Otherwise it actually slows the vehicle down as there it's more time wasted in shifting gears. The ideal transmission (theoretically) is one that delivers maximum power while maintaining the engine rpm in the sweet spot of maximum torque' with no shifting. Like, say, a CVT or fully automatic transmission.

Is that what you want to ride?

Not me.

Gotta agree with this. The FJR doesn't need 6 gears. Personally in town I usually skip 2nd gear and 4th. The torque and smoothness of the FJR allows this. At highway speeds at 80 MPH the FJR in 5th is at only around 4000 RPM. If I go beyond 80 it's only for a short time and I don't need or want a higher gear. Fastest I've had the girl is around 130...seemed to be happy as a clam with stock gearing. Do most owners buy the FJR to drag race...I don't think so. Do we buy he bike to beat super sport bikes at top end...I don't think so. It's a sport tourer for god's sake and it does that rather well at a good price point.

Bill

 

[Bogus]

My take... Designers can pick whatever final drive ratio they want for top gear, regardless of if the trans has 5 or 6 gears. They pick that based on the engine's torque/horsepower curves and desired top speed. They can also pick a lowest gear ratio based on the engine torque and desired acceleration character off the line. From there, deciding what is required for intervals of gearing is entirely dependent on what the engine torque is.
In some cases even 5 gears is overkill if the engine torque is substantial. The FJR is one such case. The torque curve Is so flat on an FJR that we could quite easily get by with only 4 cogs total... But of course all those people (and motorcycle magazine reviewers who directly influence sales) with "transmission speeds envy" would never buy a modern motorcycle with only 4 speeds. The spacing would be wider that the current 5 speed' but who has ever noticed the bike lugging after a shift from 6k rpm to 5500 rpm?

Inserting additional gears only makes a machine faster that has the engine tuned for narrow, peak power. Otherwise it actually slows the vehicle down as there it's more time wasted in shifting gears. The ideal transmission (theoretically) is one that delivers maximum power while maintaining the engine rpm in the sweet spot of maximum torque' with no shifting. Like, say, a CVT or fully automatic transmission.

Is that what you want to ride?

Not me.

Gotta agree with this. The FJR doesn't need 6 gears. Personally in town I usually skip 2nd gear and 4th. The torque and smoothness of the FJR allows this. At highway speeds at 80 MPH the FJR in 5th is at only around 4000 RPM. If I go beyond 80 it's only for a short time and I don't need or want a higher gear. Fastest I've had the girl is around 130...seemed to be happy as clam with stock gearing. Do most owners buy the FJR to drag race...I don't think so. Do we buy he bike to beat super sport bikes at top end...I don't think so. It's a sport tourer for god's sake and it does that rather well at a good price point.

Bill

It's been a while since I have seen a post go so viral......then quiet.....then viral again!! But I think FJR Bills last quote says it all. End of story? I think not.

 

[lnewlf]

lets just be done with it and drop in a CVT