FJRF003.0: Ignition Failures on FJRs

[Opelgt]

1) 2006

2) 7000miles

3) While making a slow left hand turn

4) Red was partially connected

5) Katy Yamaha in Texas, replaced ignition assembly...great new shop!

6) 7 days in shop waiting on parts just an hour or 2 to change it, plus while the tank had to be lifted I had him synch throttle bodied

7) Yes Warranty

8) Relay for accessories, no other direct power

9) They said i would have 2 keys but after reading this forum, I told him how to split the housing and puu the tumbers out and switch it..so one key!! Thanks forum!

This was a major hassle for me, the bike took a fall to the left and scratched it up some, had to borrow my wifes truck, load bike take to dealer 45 min drive then pick up later with her driving me to the dealer. Plus I have lost trust in my bike! :dribble:

 

[Zorlac]

1) 2005

2) 32,000 miles

3)Died last night pulling out from a driveway onto a main road.

4) Power stays on, but the ECU is fooled by intermittent contacts in the ignition switch.

5)N/A

6)I was stalled on the shoulder a few moments so I cycled the key off then on and then she started and ran fine after that.

7)Warranty is expired.

8) Relay for accessories, no other direct power.

9) N/A

I'm on file with the NHTSA and I'll probably splice in the relay fix soon enough, since a recall induced redesign of the ignition switch seems remote.

 

[FredandJeannesRacer]

It finally happened to me, even after taking precautions such as the occasional drop of lube.

Luckily we were only 50 yards down the road from home, when everything just died!

Neighbor gave me a hand, and we pushed it back to the garage.

Jumped the red and brown wires with a rocker switch in between, velcroed to the clutch resivour.

Thanks to this forum, I knew right away what the problem was, and how to fix it.

Now if we can only get mamma yamma to fess up...............

Fred

 

[Checkswrecks]

I do forensic engineering and may be able to show the results of switch failures to somebody who would be able to help our cause toward a recall. I really don't want to say more about who, so please don't ask, but this is on the up & up.

Would a couple of you be able to send me a switch that has failed, so we can get examples of the different failure modes? No promises and it may not be real soon, but I should be able to get your switch components back to you.

PM for my mailing address.

Thanks

Bob

 

[lnewlf]

Apparently the NY Rangers will be playing in Hell before Mammie makes an upgraded switch available. I'm going to go the relay route detailed elswhere on the Forum.While I'm in there I would like to go back to one key-since I don't have the parts from the old key cylinder does anyone know if the spare lock cylinder that came with the bike or it's tumblers would work in the ignition switch?

 

[palerider]

Apparently the NY Rangers will be playing in Hell before Mammie makes an upgraded switch available. I'm going to go the relay route detailed elswhere on the Forum.While I'm in there I would like to go back to one key-since I don't have the parts from the old key cylinder does anyone know if the spare lock cylinder that came with the bike or it's tumblers would work in the ignition switch?

Patience, Grasshopper.

 

[lnewlf]

What one vulture said to the other..."patience my ass- I'm gonna kill something"

anyhow- about the spare lockset?

 

[MrTwisty]

I had a slightly different problem with my ignition switch. The soldered wires were OK.

The problem turned out to be a sticky contact. Notice how the spring loaded contact is cocked sideways. I used a razor blade to free it up, and no more problems.

 

[Checkswrecks]

Look close at the sliding surface of the contact and make sure there's no weld material. Getting junk into a slide surface creates resistance, creating heat, creating more resistance and more heat... until things get hot enough for the copper to melt. I'm not saying it happened, just that you might check and if so then polish it out.

 

[dragonchef]

Me too...

1) What year FJR?;

2007

2) How many miles?;

12,400

3) Failed while running? Or while turning ignition? Or whatever?;

Failed while turning ignition on after getting gas.

4) Type of failure: Wires pulled out? Switch failure? Unknown? (pictures are useful);

Unknown at this time. However, jiggling the wires at the bottom of the harness will make the bike turn on/off/on/off/on/off

5) Actual repair performed and by what dealer;

in local shop now. puchased the bike in the USA and local yamaha will have NOTHING to do with me. Local shop guys pretty competent

6) How many days was the bike at the dealer for service?;

so far 2

7) Paid for by Yamaha or not?

yeah right

8) Non-OEM accessories added that contribute to electrical draw;

honda heated grips which were in use prior to this run

9) What did you do about the other locks (gas, side bags, seat and top case) on the bike (do you have two keys or one)?

TBD

10) Briefly, how badly were you inconvenienced by this ignition failure.

I was in the mountians of Korea 150 miles from home. More worried about logisitics of getting my ass and the bike back...did get it to fire and get it back, but switch was twitchy afterwards.

>edit>

Found this on 10/18/08;

 

[Neil San Diego]

I had a slightly different problem with my ignition switch. The soldered wires were OK.

The problem turned out to be a sticky contact. Notice how the spring loaded contact is cocked sideways. I used a razor blade to free it up, and no more problems.

I'm going to make a guess and say that your soldered wires are NOT OK. Most of these failures apprear to be bad/cold solder joints. The melted plastic in the plastic contact plate is probably a symptom of a bad solder joint, as opposed to a seperate issue of its own. My plastic contact plate looked exactly like yours. The solder joint had come loose, and the wire was connected by a single strand of wire. I'm pretty sure that condition is what created the heat to melt the plastic contact plate. YMMV...

 

[Checkswrecks]

I do forensic engineering and may be able to show the results of switch failures to somebody who would be able to help our cause toward a recall. I really don't want to say more about who, so please don't ask, but this is on the up & up.
Would a couple of you be able to send me a switch that has failed, so we can get examples of the different failure modes? No promises and it may not be real soon, but I should be able to get your switch components back to you.

PM for my mailing address.

Thanks

Bob

Bump

 

[MrTwisty]

Pictures deleted.
I'm going to make a guess and say that your soldered wires are NOT OK. Most of these failures apprear to be bad/cold solder joints. The melted plastic in the plastic contact plate is probably a symptom of a bad solder joint, as opposed to a seperate issue of its own. My plastic contact plate looked exactly like yours. The solder joint had come loose, and the wire was connected by a single strand of wire. I'm pretty sure that condition is what created the heat to melt the plastic contact plate. YMMV...

Thanks Neil. I think you're correct with your diagnosis. Now that you mention it, the plastic did look like it had melted a little bit. My dealer has ordered a new ignition switch, and he is going to call me when it gets in. He said everything will be covered by my YES warranty. However, I prefer to install it myself. I think I just install the new white plastic contact thingy and the new contact plate with the soldered connections into my old ignition switch...after re-soldering the connections, of course.

 

[Neil San Diego]

Thanks Neil. I think you're correct with your diagnosis. Now that you mention it, the plastic did look like it had melted a little bit. My dealer has ordered a new ignition switch, and he is going to call me when it gets in. He said everything will be covered by my YES warranty. However, I prefer to install it myself. I think I just install the new white plastic contact thingy and the new contact plate with the soldered connections into my old ignition switch...after re-soldering the connections, of course.

That sounds about right. Resoldering the leads may very well take care of the problem if it is just a cold-solder problem (which very well may be the case...?). However, while you have everything opened up, you may want to put in a relay also, just to be sure.

 

[Canes]

I do forensic engineering and may be able to show the results of switch failures to somebody who would be able to help our cause toward a recall. I really don't want to say more about who, so please don't ask, but this is on the up & up.
Would a couple of you be able to send me a switch that has failed, so we can get examples of the different failure modes? No promises and it may not be real soon, but I should be able to get your switch components back to you.

PM for my mailing address.

Thanks

Bob

Bump

 

[Brodie]

Pictures deleted.
I'm going to make a guess and say that your soldered wires are NOT OK. Most of these failures apprear to be bad/cold solder joints. The melted plastic in the plastic contact plate is probably a symptom of a bad solder joint, as opposed to a seperate issue of its own. My plastic contact plate looked exactly like yours. The solder joint had come loose, and the wire was connected by a single strand of wire. I'm pretty sure that condition is what created the heat to melt the plastic contact plate. YMMV...

Thanks Neil. I think you're correct with your diagnosis. Now that you mention it, the plastic did look like it had melted a little bit. My dealer has ordered a new ignition switch, and he is going to call me when it gets in. He said everything will be covered by my YES warranty. However, I prefer to install it myself. I think I just install the new white plastic contact thingy and the new contact plate with the soldered connections into my old ignition switch...after re-soldering the connections, of course.

Mr. Twisty,

That looks like my switch when I opened it up. The wire solder joints were intact, the copper wiper had overheated due to resistance and melted the white plastic carrier. I took a blade and freed it up too. However, if you look close the design is symmetrical. Index the white plastic carrier 180 degrees and re assemble. You now have a "new" old switch. Add the relay in the switch loop and the key switch contacts will never overheat again.

Good luck!

Brodie

 

[MrTwisty]

Pictures deleted.
I'm going to make a guess and say that your soldered wires are NOT OK. Most of these failures apprear to be bad/cold solder joints. The melted plastic in the plastic contact plate is probably a symptom of a bad solder joint, as opposed to a seperate issue of its own. My plastic contact plate looked exactly like yours. The solder joint had come loose, and the wire was connected by a single strand of wire. I'm pretty sure that condition is what created the heat to melt the plastic contact plate. YMMV...

Thanks Neil. I think you're correct with your diagnosis. Now that you mention it, the plastic did look like it had melted a little bit. My dealer has ordered a new ignition switch, and he is going to call me when it gets in. He said everything will be covered by my YES warranty. However, I prefer to install it myself. I think I just install the new white plastic contact thingy and the new contact plate with the soldered connections into my old ignition switch...after re-soldering the connections, of course.

Mr. Twisty,

That looks like my switch when I opened it up. The wire solder joints were intact, the copper wiper had overheated due to resistance and melted the white plastic carrier. I took a blade and freed it up too. However, if you look close the design is symmetrical. Index the white plastic carrier 180 degrees and re assemble. You now have a "new" old switch. Add the relay in the switch loop and the key switch contacts will never overheat again.

Good luck!

Brodie

Thanks Brodie. I did turn the white plastic thingy 180 degrees, and I will put the relay in the loop. I appreciate the advice from everyone.

Twisty

 

[palerider]

Neil,

What relay are you using?

 

[Neil San Diego]

Neil,
What relay are you using?

Palerider,

Here is the relay that I used. FYI, I ordered the wrong one, in that I meant to get one with a flange that I could use to bolt it down. This one doesn't have a flange. Oh well, I just zip tied it into place.

https://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch...ame=255-2082-ND

I went with Ionbeams suggestion (I think it was Ionbeam...?) and got a 70A relay. Bigger is probably better in this application. Can't hurt anyway, and these things are fairly cheap.

Only problem with this particular relay, is that it uses a large female blade plug for the main power connections. It took me longer to locate those damned blades in town, than it took to do the entire repair job! :angry2:

 

[Brodie]

Only problem with this particular relay, is that it uses a large female blade plug for the main power connections. It took me longer to locate those damned blades in town, than it took to do the entire repair job! :angry2:

Neal

Try this... clicky

Direct fit up socket ( R95-160A ) for our Panasonic 70 amp relay.

Brodie