Handling Issues '05 FJR - any suggestions

[Pooh]

Here's the issue.

The bike feels like it wants' to dive/fall into right hand bends. Lefts are perfect and the bike feels rock solid but when I approach a right hander, whether it's a slow or a fast bend the bike just feels like it's not happy being there.

Now this could be down to one of 2 things. Either something wrong with me ( I'm imagining it ) or summit up with the bike

To illustrate what I mean. When we go into a bend we, albeit it very slightly, apply a little pull on the handle bars on the opposite side, i.e. pull on right bar for a left bend and left bar for a right hander. Some people do the opposite and push the same side of the bar as the direction of the bend.

When I'm taking a right hand bend I get the feeling that I need to make a much more deliberate manouver to get the bike to behave and go where I want it to.

It's been this way for a while now but I guess I just got used to it. With having been off the bike over the winter I seem to notice it a lot more again.

Bike is an '05 with just under 9,000 on the clock.

Things I've checked so far.

1 - Tyre pressure F36 & R42, pretty much standard

2 - Tyres seated in properly. They have done approx 4,000 miles but are in good condition I can't see any signs of unever wear.

3 - Suspension - left & right sides are matched exactly and set just above the default settings, being a little harder. Rear is set on factory default. Forks are in exactly the same positions in the upper bracket in the steering head.

4 - All the nuts & bolts are tight.

I've got a Yamaha topbox fitted but it's mainly empty so shouldn't affect the centre of gravity. Only other addition is a CeBailley large screen. Due to the fact the symptoms manifest themselves both at low and high speed I don't think this is causing the problem.

I'm a bit stumped what to try next, anyone got any suggestions ??

Thanks

Pooh

 

[Jetmaker737]

Have you checked your compression and rebound dampening settings to make sure they're symmetrical left and right? (just a shot in the dark.)

 

[Duff]

It could be a number of things:

- You have a dominant turn direction and it is more mental than you think. (Most people turn better one way than the other)

- With 4000 miles, you are a good bit through the tire life and it is worn so that turns need more input in general

- The above two items have combined to give more wear on one side versus the other and you truely DO need more input for turns in one direction.

- You have a VERY dominant hand/arm and the pull required feels less on that side.

- Your bike is not balanced/tracking in a perfectly vertical position and the distance to move the bike into a proper lean angle for one turns is greater than the other.

Just a few ideas of things to look at.

 

[Pooh]

Thanks Guys

The compression & rebound dampening is equall on both sides.

I'm probably leaning ( pardon the pun ) to the problem being with me. I had surgery on my left arm last year and maybe it's affecting me more than I thought. I'm no 7 stone weakling but maybe I'm over compensating with the right handers. My strength is good on both arms ( I excercise with a some weights and do 30 to 40 reps with a 20lb dumbell )

Next time I'm out I'll get one of my FJR mates to take my bike for a spin and see how he gets on with it.

 

[HotRodZilla]

I had surgery on my left arm last year and maybe it's affecting me more than I thought. I'm no 7 stone weakling but maybe I'm over compensating with the right handers. My strength is good on both arms ( I excercise with a some weights and do 30 to 40 reps with 20lb dumbell )

You'd actually be amazed at the amount of atrophy your muscle groups go through after surgery and the obligitory lack of movement and exercise afterwards. I had the ACL replaced in my right knee last year. When the doc gave me the ok to get back to the gym, I immediately hit the squat rack again. Since I free squat about 500lbs, I put some light weight on a squat rack and tried to get to work. I lowered the rack and couldn't lift it because it was binding up. I thought something was broken but my friend worked it fine. Turns out, even with no weight on the machine, my left leg was pushing a lot harder than my right, causing the rack to tweak to far over. Something like that may be your problem with the bike. If it is, your body will eventually catch up, but it goes away faster than it gains.

 

[user 8909]

my first thought were the tires, then that big trunk you have on the back and what was in it? try a ride without the trunk.

but if your instincts tell you that it may be your strength, you're probably right.

 

[Pooh]

The topbox is pretty much empty. No weight to speak off apart from the actual box itself.

I discounted the box as being the issue as I would get the problem on both left and right handers if it were.

 

[Sherman]

Front Tire - give us a picture.

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

my first thought were the tires,...

I'm with 'KIEEFER', here -- the FJR can be brutal on tires. The 021 'Stones' front can be shot in that amount of miles. Putting on new tires will 'tell the tale'.

Just for experiment -- up the pressures, F&R, by alot (say?, 10 lbs) and see if it makes a difference. Certainly, if your problem goes away -- you'll know the answer.

Edit: Yes -- what 'Sherman' said.

 

[Kevin Daly]

- With 4000 miles, you are a good bit through the tire life and it is worn so that turns need more input in general
- The above two items have combined to give more wear on one side versus the other and you truely DO need more input for turns in one direction.

I'm with Duff on this thought (by the way nice 08 Duff). if you look straight down on the front tire you should be able to see the profile of the tire. my bet is that you have a flattened profile on the right side; that is the tire no longer curves smoothly. This may be an indication that you tend to break more while in right handers. I think some people tend to do that more because the righthander tends to be more of a blind corner.

my 2c

 

[Duff]

- With 4000 miles, you are a good bit through the tire life and it is worn so that turns need more input in general
- The above two items have combined to give more wear on one side versus the other and you truely DO need more input for turns in one direction.

I'm with Duff on this thought (by the way nice 08 Duff)...

Thanks for the compliment Kevin.

By the way, I think I have the opposite problem. Instead of braking on right-handers, I accellerate harder on left-handers and wear the left side of the rear tire more. It is absolutly amazing how much the profile of the tire affects the entrance to a corner.

New tires ROCK! :yahoo:

 

[Pooh]

OK - I've cleaned the cr*p from the front, dried it, jacked up the front end, got the camera out and had a really good look at the tyre in daylight. It looks like it's seen better days

It does seem like there is a definate uneveness especially on the right hand side which would explain the falling in.

I'm really dissapointed in only getting 4000 from the front. The back's not too bad, a little squared off but nowhere near as uneven as the front

Anyone suggest a good alternative to Avon Storm ST

What do you think ?

 

[SPORT]

To illustrate what I mean. When we go into a bend we, albeit it very slightly, apply a little pull on the handle bars on the opposite side, i.e. pull on right bar for a left bend and left bar for a right hander. Some people do the opposite and push the same side of the bar as the direction of the bend.
Pooh

Not to minimize your concern about steering, but I'm curious why you would want to 'pull' over 'push' when turning.

You have more leverage when you push; you have more strength when you push; it's typically more natural when you push; I have been taught (both from other riders and from experience) that if the bike begins to speed wabble, pushing both bars reduces the speed wabble easier than pulling. This is not to assume it is the only way, rather, better practice leads to better riding skills.

Hope you find your steering issue.

I tend to agree that it is probably the tire wearing less on one side than the other due to a preferred turning direction. As stated above, all of us have a preferred turn direction. I prefer to turn left over right, thus my tire may lean nicely in a left turn but will drop off when making a right turn.

 

[Checkswrecks]

Being worn on one side, you might think of two ideas to look into. First, especially with your surgery, is how you sit on the bike? Are you really sure that you sit the bike straight up, and not with a bit more weight on the left? You might even take a ride with a friend behind who is watching for it. If you really want to make it visual for the person, tie a weighted string to the center of your back rack. Second idea is to see if one of your fork springs has taken a sag. Pull both springs and simply stand them next to each other. If one's started to collapse it'll stand out quick.

You'll find proponents of all sorts of tires. Guess that's why ,ost tire threads end up in the NEPRT column. I still like the Pilot Roads, but people are now liking the PR2's and trying the new Dunlops.

Bob

 

[Duff]

It does seem like there is a definate uneveness especially on the right hand side which would explain the falling in.
I'm really dissapointed in only getting 4000 from the front. The back's not too bad, a little squared off but nowhere near as uneven as the front

Anyone suggest a good alternative to Avon Storm ST

Pooh,

Great pictures and a perfect example of what most of us were thinking. Tire wear is significan and will make a significant

differnce in the handling.

My first question is this: What are your tire pressures? This is a heavy bike... you need to run the tires pretty full. I RECOMMEND 42 Rear and about 39 Front. 42 would be max for the rear and that is due to weight and stress. Same logic goes for front, but there isn't quite as much weight up there and no need to max it out.

My experience with the Storms was that they felt hard and not real "grippy". Again, it's just my opinion. MANY other have had great success and swear by the storm. I found that I liked the Pilot Roads and they gave me the best "feel". There are plenty that HATE the Pilot Roads. Tire choice is highly debated and more information than you can shake a stick at will be found in the Never Ending, Pointles blah, blah, blah... threads.

I average about 5-6K miles on a set of tires. I tend to be on the throttle and have no trouble dragging a peg now-and-then. Others get more... some get less... YMMV.

Tire pressure... know it, live it, learn from it.

Also, good suggestions above about riding posture and strength in the arm. Although it isn't critical, it appears you ARE wearing one side more than the other. As long as you are aware of it, you shouldn't have any real troubles.

 

[Pooh]

Hmmmm... Interesting

I am running the tyres at 42 rear and 36 front. A couple of PSI can make a big difference to handling.

I'll stick some air in the front till I get it replaced and see if that makes any difference.

Thans for the feedback guys . appreciated.

 

[Kevin Daly]

Hmmmm... InterestingI am running the tyres at 42 rear and 36 front. A couple of PSI can make a big difference to handling.

I'll stick some air in the front till I get it replaced and see if that makes any difference.

Thans for the feedback guys . appreciated.

Pooh,

Some quick comments, the left side is flattened as I and others thought. at this point adding pressure will not change that and may make the bike more squirerly in the front end. Also, now that you have noticed this, you can attribute you sense of skiddishness to what has happened to the tire. I HIGHLY recomend replacing it. It is my opinion that the longer you ride on a tire like the more you will habitually spook on the right handers and hence the more you will brake in right handers. what you want to do is get out of that habit this means gaining confidence. that will come in part with a new tire that doesnt drop you abruptly.

Also, you definately want to work on pushing the handle bars. Get a book called Total Control by Lee Parks. in it he describes why this is better.

-k

 

[Fred W]

Did you ever notice that the left side of the front always gets more worn than the right?

Yep it's true. Wanna know why?

Read hither

 

[Kevin Daly]

Did you ever notice that the left side of the front always gets more worn than the right?
Yep it's true. Wanna know why?

Read hither

Ok, but we be talkin bout more wear on the right Fred