My service nightmare

[donaldb]

Ok, I'm gonna save the worst/best for last. But for now I am gonna break down my service bill from yesterday and if by chance anyone out there knows the service book hours for these service items I would appreciate them letting me know if what was charged is accurate by the book.

1.Sync throttle body-1.0

2. ck steering head bearings-.4 (this seems high to me, we all know all they did was sit someone on back seat while on center stand and lift the front wheel off the ground and ck for play?)

3. Remove rear tire & lube splines-1.0

4. Lube and service swing arm bushings and u joint-2.0 (this seems high to me since they already had the rear tire off?)

5. clean air filter-.3

6. check wheel bearings-.4 (this seems high to me, see #2 above, again we all know the rear wheel was off and sight inspected and the front wheel was just wiggled back and forth to ck for play?)

7. lube pivot points-.8

8. lube cables-.2

9. flush break and clutch lines-1.5 plus fluid 2@ 6.00=12.00 parts

Add shop supplies of $9.12 plus tax of $33.40 for a total of $510.50

labor rate was $60.00 pr hour

Now the best for last: I paid my bill, left as they were closing shop, my ride there left ahead of me, I did not have my cel phone. My bike was brought around front for me and I geared up, including ear plugs, got on the bike cranked, ck'd breaks, seemed to work fine, let bike warm up, pull out of parking lot go about .2-.3 miles to first light and stop, felt like play in rear break, hmmm, just needs more time to build up line pressure, note to self be careful w/breaks on way home. Continue on from light, go about 1-2 miles to next left turn, apply rear break to slow, still lots of play, followed by a double quick rear break pressure release, hmmm, bubbles in line? note to self again, remain careful w/breaks, continue on another 2 miles to next intersection, come to stop, still lots of play in rear break, this time I hear over my ear plugs and motor and feel in the peddle a grinding-rubbing sound at very slow speed, just before I come to complete stop. Now I'm concerned, I am still about 4 miles from the house. I continue on, having to make a few more stops, condition continues the rest of the way home. As soon as I get there I w/help from my neighbor put the bike on center stand and spin rear wheel, rubbing, grinding sound from rear break caliper area, closer inspection reveals the inside of the rotar is cut and pitted and just in general chewed up. I also notice heavy mud splattered on my swing arm and up under rear fender (people I don't take my bike through mud besides, it hasn't rained here in over a week), I don't know if they got a rock stuck between the caliper and rotar, a washer, nut, etc. stuck in there or if they got the break pad off flat, or possibly broke the pad, but in that short 7 mile ride home I think my rotar is ruined and probably my rear pad.

Now if that aint just fine service after paying a $500.00 bill!!

So, folks, I already know I took a screwing, but I would like to know your thoughts about the time they charged for the things they did, does it seem fair to you? am I being to critical? :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: Yes, I am calling them this morning and having them go to my house and pick up my bike and take it back and repair the rear break.

 

[radman]

Frank (05) has been to the dealer zero (0) times in almost 2 years. When the dash bezel cracked, I removed and they replaced the part under warranty, which I then installed. Yet another tale that helps me to remember why. In fact other than new purchases, the exact number of service calls paid by me to dealers in 40 years? Zero (0). If Frank should get the tick, I will be the best informed guy here on the procedure and how long it should take, because I am camping on their lawn, literally. As far as your deal, proceed with caution, more flies with honey etc, not everything is as it first appears. All too often, folks have gone off half cocked only to be mortally embarassed when it turns out to be something totally above board. Me included.

 

[Scab]

Don't know about the book times for sure. But, if that was my baby they had apart and it just ate the rotor...well, they would be gettin' off the hip for some new crap.

And check your odo this time before you leave it.

 

[donaldb]

Hey Radman, a lot of you guys-including yourself are a lot better mechanically and have the knowledge and ability to handle a lot of this sort of maintenance. Some of the stuff I had them do I probably could have done myself and rest assured after paying that bill I will take to time and effort to do so next time.

 

[donaldb]

I just got off the phone w/dealership--they are headed out to my house this morning w/trailer to pick up the bike from my workshop bldg. I left it unlocked and key in ignition. They are suppose to call me this afternoon w/respect to the rear break issue

 

[MCRIDER007]

It sounds like they charged you for a mechanic to spend the entire day just on your bike. He must be a trainee or have spent a lot of time on the phone or on coffee breaks.

It almost sounds like your rear brake pads are missing but I don't know any reason they would have removed them so that probably is not the case.

 

[crewof1]

Maybe they're like a car dealer I'm familiar with that wants to charge book rates for each individual task involved in the service, so that it adds up to way more time than it actually took. Not necessarily unethical, but I choose to work with a service guy (for my truck) that works with me on labor charges.

For my bike, it has 6500 miles on it and it's not been to the dealer(yet), and I am having fun learning to maintain it from the advice given here and a few websites devoted to the topic. So far, so good!

 

[donaldb]

I think you are right mcrider, the head mechanic at this dealership is a guy named Richard, the tec who worked on my bike is a guy named Brandon, I think I saw him yesterday when I picked up my bike, a young guy I had not seen there before.

 

[radman]

Betcha Brandon put the rear pads in bass-ackwards.

 

[Scab]

Another thing you have to watch for is the "overlap". Even though the times may be according to the "book", some operations are considered overlap - for example, you would charge "x" to remove rear brake caliper but only charge "y" it you have already removed the rear wheel. (this may not be acurate, just for example)

You will find that a lot of businesses using labor guides for billing do not do this. First off, it cuts into profit. Secondly, they actually have to read the manual and learn how to use it properly. Third, it requires math skills.

However, with all that said, if the shop uses a computer program to estimate and calculate labor charges, these "overlaps" will be done automatically.

And the times charged have nothing to do with how long it actually takes. It is an established average for the operation in question. Any good mechanic can beat the book. That's how they make a living. Generally speaking, the shop is actually going to expect a seasoned tech to produce at a rate of about 150%. That means for a forty hour work week, the shop was able to bill 60 hours worth of operations for said tech.

and as for "Brandon" - After hearing all the stories about the FJR, he just had to take it out and TWIST THE **** out of it!

 

[donaldb]

To add insult to injury, Mississippi isn't known for its high population of FJR's by any stretch of the imagination. I inquired w/Richard as to how many they had worked on, his response----including mine---3 :blink: Your probably right Radman Brandon probably put the pad in backwards, or he broke the pad somehow when he spread them to release the caliper from the rotor--probably used a screwdriver

 

[Scab]

"Brandon" filled your caliper full of gravel while doing his test "scratch-off" on YOUR bike.

 

[Randy]

Betcha Brandon put the rear pads in bass-ackwards.

My bet is that he put the rear wheel in and, instead of ensuring the rotor was between the pads, the pads slid together and there is now 1 side of the rotor hitting the puck and the other side of the rotor hitting the backside of a pad.

If that's the case, new caliper, new rotor.

 

[jestal]

I wonder what "cables" they "lubed" and charged you for...????

There are no brake and clutch cables. Lubing the throttle cables is usually forbidden due to the possibility of any "lube" causing throttle sticking and dust/dirt collection.

Wonder what they lubed???

 

[sparky3008]

I wrote a whole big paragraph on how you can do this stuff and then just figured that's not what you want to hear anyway.

So I hope it works out for you and the dealer is a stand up business.

Good luck...

As far as overpaying, it is really a mute point. You could have asked what they were going to bill you before hand and if you didn't agree decline but there isn't much negotiating to be done...

 

[sparky3008]

I wonder what "cables" they "lubed" and charged you for...????
There are no brake and clutch cables. Lubing the throttle cables is usually forbidden due to the possibility of any "lube" causing throttle sticking and dust/dirt collection.

Wonder what they lubed???

Took the mechanic .2 of an hour to figure out no lube necessary.

 

[MrVvrroomm]

Frank (05) has been to the dealer zero (0) times in almost 2 years.

My '04, new in August of '03 has been back to the dealer, or any dealer for that matter, exactly ZERO times. It has been over to Rad's place for a group head bearing torque.

Thanks Rad!

 

[FJRMGM]

sounds like flat rate charges to me.

So, are they fair? No.. But is that the hours they can bill for each item? Yes..

Get with one of us next time and we can show you how to do most if not all of this by yourself.

Two-tenths of an hour (12 minutes) to lube the cables? Probably for throttle cables.

 

[sparky3008]

I use to install auto glass and was paid on commission based on hour labor rates.

It was amazing that at times a windshield that was one of the hardest to do gave you the least hours and some of the easiest gave you like 4 hours. Never did makes much sense to me...