Stripped cam cap bolt hole/ Not fun. Thoughts

[n2osx]

Oh, come on. He needs the wonderful opportunity to learn how fun it is to swap a head!

Listen here Don. I have a hammer and a Sawzall and I know where Ray's shop is! Would I still find one of your toys there perhaps? lol

 

[dcarver]

Oh, come on. He needs the wonderful opportunity to learn how fun it is to swap a head!

Listen here Don. I have a hammer and a Sawzall and I know where Ray's shop is! Would I still find one of your toys there perhaps? lol

I fold! Those two old BMW's are to precious for a Sawmill and hammer! Besides, that's Ray's job. You scabbing on Ray's work now? That cold be dangerous.. He's a big feller!

Back on topic - of course I'm just teasing about pulling the head. All other options are better.

 

[n2osx]

He is a big .... something! But you couldn't have anyone better taking care of them properly! He does a great job.

So this morning before work, I went out and did some measuring with a cap on and off the cam. and gauging from what I found, it looks like I have just about 1/4 inch of hole left under the bolt that I can finish threading, if it's not already. (I didn't have time to try to bottom out the bolt.)

If that is the case, I am getting a stud (not you Carver!), dropping it in there, add epoxy for more piece of mind, let it cure, and then button it up with a nut. And about time the damned thing is done SHAZZAM! I need this thing back on the road. It is my main source of transportation.

Thank again everyone!

Carl

 

[hppants]

I like your plan. Patience is called for here. Let the epoxy cure fully. Use a 1/4" drive ratchet with your palm over the top (purposefully works against over torqueing). Feel the gasket compress a little and call it done. Don't get over crazy about getting to the specified torque. Run it up to temperature and shine the light from below (if on the exhaust side) or otherwise to verify no leaks and if so, STOP. Don't do anything else.

Good luck - let us know how it goes.

 

[Fred W]

What gaskets? We are talking about the cam shaft caps. No gaskets there.

But I like the rest of your plan. Until the camshaft goes rocketing through the cam cover. Then...

It was someone else that suggested the epoxy fix.

 

[n2osx]

What gaskets? We are talking about the cam shaft caps. No gaskets there.
But I like the rest of your plan. Until the camshaft goes rocketing through the cam cover. Then...

It was someone else that suggested the epoxy fix.

Your secret is safe with me! Nobody reads these forums anyway...

 

[n2osx]

Sooooo, I just pulled up this thread to post an update and Amy glances over at the name of this posting and thought it said "Stripped But Hole, Thoughts?" LOL

Anyway, I figured that I would post some pictures of the progress. There really isn't much to it. Measured everything several times with a micrometer and then get the right size of studs. Clean everything well so that the epoxy sticks well. I used Brake Clean on Q-Tips to clean out the holes that the studs are going into.

Epoxy all mixed.

https://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d51/n2osx/Mobile%20Uploads/20150429_193218.jpg'>https://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d51/n2osx/Mobile%20Uploads/20150429_193218.jpg</a><br

Studs put in with 2 nuts locked together.

https://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d51/n2osx/Mobile%20Uploads/20150429_193229.jpg'>https://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d51/n2osx/Mobile%20Uploads/20150429_193229.jpg</a><br

Studs in place.

https://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d51/n2osx/Mobile%20Uploads/20150429_193445.jpg'>https://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d51/n2osx/Mobile%20Uploads/20150429_193445.jpg</a><br

Caps in place with studs.

https://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d51/n2osx/Mobile%20Uploads/20150429_194009.jpg'>https://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d51/n2osx/Mobile%20Uploads/20150429_194009.jpg</a><br

Now, have to let them cure.

Carl

 

[HotRodZilla]

Dammit...

Ref below: No, I was trying to fix those pics, but not gettin any love.

 

[n2osx]

What? Did you read the same thing?

 

[08FJR4ME]

He is using the wrong format to post with. URL instead of IMG

 

[n2osx]

He is using the wrong format to post with. URL instead of IMG

I tried several times to use the URL and it kept telling me something that

"An error occurredYou are not allowed to use that image extension on this community."

I have never had problems posting pictures before. Is it just in this area that we are not allowed?

Carl

 

[HotRodZilla]

No, pictures are allowed, it's just that this software is FUBAR. From the 'share' link in Photobucket, use the 'Direct' option. Copy that and it should work.

 

[dcarver]

 

[Fred W]

Sooooo, I just pulled up this thread to post an update and Amy glances over at the name of this posting and thought it said "Stripped But Hole, Thoughts?" LOL
Anyway, I figured that I would post some pictures of the progress. There really isn't much to it. Measured everything several times with a micrometer and then get the right size of studs. Clean everything well so that the epoxy sticks well. I used Brake Clean on Q-Tips to clean out the holes that the studs are going into.

Epoxy all mixed.

Studs put in with 2 nuts locked together.



Studs in place.



Caps in place with studs.



Now, have to let them cure.

Carl

Photo assist above. Nice work, Kemosabe!

 

[n2osx]

Photo assist above. Nice work, Kemosabe!

Thank you Fred. I tried it again here and it told me the same thing, but when I tried it in the Photo Test area, it worked with no problem.

 

[escapefjrtist]

Nice job Carl, glad you're back on the road again!

--G

 

[wfooshee]

I was reminded of another instance I've seen recently of using studs to repair threads. It's a common solution I've seen on the forum I found for my new-to-me Aurora. It seems some small percentage of Northstar motors simply let go of the metal around cylinder head bolts, resulting in "blown" head gaskets. I used quotes because the gasket doesn't actually get blown, or at least not until the head actually loosens. Coolant loss and overheating is a common symptom once the seal between block and head goes away.

Most common fix is replacing the head bolts with studs, just like the cam caps in this thread. This was actually the first thing I thought of as I read the thread, but it had already been covered, and even done, before I got here. Apparently it's actually rather uncommon to NOT have to do this if you have to remove the heads for some other reason; the bolts will almost always pull some block threads out with them.

As an aside, the second most common fix is finding a junkyard Cadillac and dropping the 4.6 into the Aurora. External dimensions are identical between the 4.0 and 4.6 (same block, different sleeves,) and you get up to a 50 HP increase.

 

[Fred W]

Back in the Pre-GM days of SAAB, the 2.3 liter 4 cylinder turbo engines had a propensity for blowing head gaskets, which would often result in the deck of the block. become pitted and eroded SAAB's official Service Bulletin detailed repair of the block by filling the eroded area with JB Weld epoxy, then planing it flat before re-installing the head with a new gasket. Although I was unlucky enough to have the "opportunity" to replace the head gasket on one 93 9000cse, I caught the symptoms before any block erosion occurred, so did not need to use the filler.

Point of the story: Epoxy (JB Weld and the others like it) is some pretty amazing stuff.

 

[Panman]

I was reminded of another instance I've seen recently of using studs to repair threads. It's a common solution I've seen on the forum I found for my new-to-me Aurora. It seems some small percentage of Northstar motors simply let go of the metal around cylinder head bolts, resulting in "blown" head gaskets. I used quotes because the gasket doesn't actually get blown, or at least not until the head actually loosens. Coolant loss and overheating is a common symptom once the seal between block and head goes away.
Most common fix is replacing the head bolts with studs, just like the cam caps in this thread. This was actually the first thing I thought of as I read the thread, but it had already been covered, and even done, before I got here. Apparently it's actually rather uncommon to NOT have to do this if you have to remove the heads for some other reason; the bolts will almost always pull some block threads out with them.

As an aside, the second most common fix is finding a junkyard Cadillac and dropping the 4.6 into the Aurora. External dimensions are identical between the 4.0 and 4.6 (same block, different sleeves,) and you get up to a 50 HP increase.

My son's 97 STS went thru this issue, did a lot of research and found that the longer stud way was at best a way to sell the car and burn someone with a motor that wouldn't last to long. The real fix was to pull the motor drill and put a course threaded timesert in to use the later style head bolt. No backing from Government Motors fix is on you. The STS was a money pit and a real good reason never to buy from Government Motors!