Yeagh WW it has been a real pain in the ass considering how little time I have to fool with it because of my job. I actually thought the new airbox and filters might be the problem at first. I removed the new airbox setup and went back to the old airbox and the problem was still there. I finally disconnected the wideband commander and LCD from the power commander and everything went back to normal. Nobody at Dynojet has yet been able to explain exactly why the power commander made the actual fuel air ratios go so rich with the same map that ran fine when not connected to the WB commander and LCD display other than incompatible software. I actually had to go from +15 numbers in some cells to -22 to get the fuel back in line and that still didn't fully solve the problems. There is no basic problem with the design or compabability of the dynojet components as long as they all have compatible software. I have several friends running this setup on dragbikes and it works fine. Wish I had the time to fool with it more so I could have found the real problem sooner. I have owned quite a few power commanders over the years with few problems and they have always taken care of any problems even out of warranty ones.
Wicked Webby's Airbox Mod
- Thread starter UselessPickles
- Start date
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The wife tells me I got the power commander back from Jamie at Fuel Moto today with the updated firmware installed. Great service from Fuel Moto since I UPS'ed it ground on Monday the 4th and got it back today on the 8th. Hopefully everything will work together now and I can tune the bike properly to the new airbox mods. I am in New Orleans now and hopefully all the rain will be gone in the midwest when I get home next week.
UselessPickles
Making Grand Canyon replicas from air boxes...
Looks like some of the predictions were correct about the custom filters not being strong enough due to the flattening of the pleats: https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php?showtopic=120044
I'll be buying a new air box and only partially modifying it so that it still accepts a stock-style filter.
I'll be buying a new air box and only partially modifying it so that it still accepts a stock-style filter.
animalrooster41
Well-known member
Well, I had my doubts, all I can say is "Thanks Webby". I had been looking for more power and finally got the sack to carve up my air box. Now with that mod alone, it's bad news,(boggs hard,needs fuel) but add the techlusion and a few co from the barbarian mod and BOOM BABY! I have 2 fjr's in the garage, one is my son's 04, and my 06. I can ride them back to back for comparision. My 06 has more power everywhere than my sons stock 04! I can tell the most in 5th when I rock the throttle. Mine will give a jolt or jump, then go. My sons is just a steady pull. I have stock cans and header, so I was not sure how well it was going to work for me. I followed that recipie to the "T", so I might be a tad rich (because of stock exhaust). Definately more power, top, bottom and middle. Still have not balanced the throttle bodys to smooth it out. Now I can't wait to open up the exhaust. :yahoo:
UselessPickles
Making Grand Canyon replicas from air boxes...
animalrooster: keep an eye on your flattened air filters. Click the link in the post just above yours to see why.
animalrooster41
Well-known member
I will, and I did see your post. Thanks pickles. If I go to a full exhaust you think I will loose my bottom end torque? It's the power I want. I will take the noisy cans (I like the beowolfs) if it gives me the little extra power. Any thoughts?
RadioHowie
I Miss Beemerdons!
Yep....you need yer a$$ kicked for resurrecting this festering, brain-eating zombie of a thread.
People in Raccoon City are cursing your name RIGHT NOW!
animalrooster41
Well-known member
Ya, ya, I know. It's still relavant today for the very, very few of us that are in search of any extra power we can get. I think only a handfull of riders have actually done this. I just wanted to chime in that what worked many years ago is still being done today, since mother yamaha is still pumping out this bike. I seen this topic was dead when I first purchased my bike 2 years ago, but had to try it. My bike revs faster and definately makes more power. It's not for everyone. Not many who will go to the lengths WW did for the benifit of a few and tons of ridicule that went with it. Now let's see, where do I go from here? Where is that nitrous thread again?
RadioHowie
I Miss Beemerdons!
Where do you go? Howzabout to a Dynojet store and see if all that extra power is real POWER and not just intake noise?
Now, now,Howie. Wouldn't that sort of defeat the whole "performance modification on a shoestring" concept?
I mean., spending $100 (or more) on dyno time would negate most of the savings of a homebrewed air box chop. Right?
My suggestion for the "next step" is to do the Trooper exhaust can core. Open that bad boy up at both ends!!
It'll either be a lot faster, a lot louder, or both! :thumbsup:
rushes
Well-known member
I can't remember the name of the dude that cut the right side out of the airbox.
Anyway, I tried it, and it makes cool noise!
But I lost 2 to 3 MPG, so I duc taped the hole back up.
I wear out tires about the same rate either way...
edit...
Maybe just remembered. Cdog mod I think...
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UselessPickles
Making Grand Canyon replicas from air boxes...
Wicked Webby's tests were done with Remus Hexacone slip-ons and a stock header, so you can't expect the same results as him with stock exhaust. I would guess that any after-market slip-on would give similar results.
As for a full exhaust system, I think only the single-sided Muzzy would have potential for giving good gains. Otherwise, stick with the stock header and slip-ons of your choice. I found that the Holeshot header caused a loss of torque in a couple RPM ranges. I'm now back to a stock header and happier. Here's the dyno results (ignore everything that Wicked Webby says in this thread; I did finally narrow down my losses to the Holeshot header): https://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php?showtopic=120164
Yup, I "downgraded" from the Wicked Webby air box mod to the Cdog air box mod after my engine ate my air filters. I have a self-tuning system (Motty AFR Tuner; works similarly to the Power Commander AutoTune), so I was able to compare the fuel maps before/after switching from Webby to Cdog. My conclusion is that there is no difference in the fuel maps, therefore there must no difference in the amount of airflow between the 2 mods. Since Webby has dyno results showing gains with his mods, I'd have to believe that the Cdog mod with after-market cans and properly adjusted fueling would give the same gains. The Cdog mod's benefits are that you continue using stock (or stock-like) filters, and the engine won't eat your filter
I think it's worth emphasizing that the key to making intake/exhaust mods work well is to get the fuel properly tuned. Adjusting broad settings (CO settings, Techlusion tuner, or similar) cannot possibly account for the varying fuel needs at different throttle/RPM positions. Also, adjusting based on "feel" is worthless. Get it properly tuned on a dyno with a Power Commander or similar. Or do lots of research on air/fuel ratios until you are confident that you can decide what ratios you want under different conditions, then get a self-tuning system (Motty AFR tuner, PCV + AutoTune) and get the enjoyment of tweaking your bike yourself in a relatively safe manner to get your preferred balance of smoothness and fuel mileage.
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FWIW, Wicked Webby got his posted improvements after only adjusting the CO settings to enrich the fuel mixture.
As I recall, he had no PC3 or other FI tuning device installed.
As I recall, he had no PC3 or other FI tuning device installed.
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UselessPickles
Making Grand Canyon replicas from air boxes...
I'm not sure if you're implying that the CO settings might have been what gave him the gains and the air box mod had no effect. Or maybe your just reinforcing that intake/exhaust mods must be accompanied by fuel adjustments?
The shape of Wicked Webby's torque curve was significantly changed after the air box mod + CO adjustments (big gain in the mid range). The change in shape of the torque curve could mean one of two things:
1) The air box mod altered airflow into the engine such that more air was available in the mid-range and, when accompanied with more fuel, produced more torque.
2) The stock fuel map was so horribly lean in the mid range (at full throttle) that adding more fuel gave a significant increase in torque there.
I think #1 is much more likely. Remember that the stock FJR lean hesitation/surging issues are at part throttle; not full throttle. The stock bike actually runs richer than necessary at full throttle, probably as a safety net to protect against mild modifications (after-market slip-ons) that will allow some more airflow. Look at a Power Commander fuel map for a stock FJR - it decreases fuel across the entire RPM range at full throttle.
FJRAE
Well-known member
Fwiw, the AE model is a bit of a pain in the ass just to check the damn filter, anyway I did a half of WW's mod, well maybe a quarter, by cutting out the inner snorkel protrusion and then cutting the airhorn and outer cover that acts as mounting point for the clutch master cylinder so that it's a straight through effect looking directly into the air filter assembly. All of the work and research done by WW ,UP and CD (and anyone else I inadvertently missed) is much appreciated, I will only say that I did not lose any power/acceleration, hopefully that will keep the resident skeptics at bay, disturbing the status quo really unsettles some people!
It was the latter. I was agreeing with you that extra fuel is required when reducing intake (or exhaust) restriction, but that just bumping the CO up was apparently enough to get him into those numbers. Certainly there would have been further improvement with a FI trimmer (Power Commander or the like).
mferriter
Occasionally trying to get work done
just leave the filter out and buy a new engine every 3000 miles - like at every oil change.
that really improves performance
that really improves performance
FJRAE
Well-known member
Just leave your manpon out and buy some cajones, that'll really improve your disposition.
animalrooster41
Well-known member
I will be purchasing the full muzzy single system tomorrow. Talked to the local dyno shop the other day about tuning my 06 with the techlusion and the full WW air box mod. Will post dyno sheet when done.
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