Yami Dealers

[fjr]

"Correct! If the dealer does not warranty register the bike in the name of the original person the deposit is forfeited and Yamaha keeps it. This is why people that purchased one off of a dealers floor had the bike already registered in another name so the dealer could get their deposit back that the dealer put up when the bike was ordered as there was no real customer in the first place. by Tony"

I bought my 05 on the floor. I got the origin certificate or do you mean it is changing for 06? I'm confused?

I know the dealer i bought from ordered extra 06s as well. Does this mean if you buy an 06 off the floor it will be "used?" :dribble:

 

[sparky3008]

One of the main reasons I made the decision to purchase my '05 was because it was on the dealer floor- no waiting required. I had heard a rumor that some were around, which is the only reason I stopped at the dealer in the first place. I had zero interest in the PDP program, and I mean ZERO, nada, none. In my opinion, the concept of waiting several months for the product to be delivered is just plain bullshit for the consumer.
I can appreciate the ability of the PDP to help out the dealers, but if the consumer has to wait then they should at least be able to choose from the full range of colors, and perhaps factory installed options like heated grips, cruise control, etc. Offering the custom options would make waiting more palatable, but if all I get is the cookie cutter choices, then waiting is out of the question.

Just my .02

Your not waiting any longer than those who are waiting on the new FZ1 your just guaranteed to get one! My 1st FZ1 is scheduled for April and we are only getting 2 of this model. The new R6 has just started shipping in last month or so. The bikes are being released at about the same time as the rest of the sport bike line the only difference is you are guaranteed delivery of this model if you place a deposit.

Regards,

Tony Orihuela

Thank you for saying this, I have been saying this all along

 

[charismaticmegafauna]

"Correct! If the dealer does not warranty register the bike in the name of the original person the deposit is forfeited and Yamaha keeps it. This is why people that purchased one off of a dealers floor had the bike already registered in another name so the dealer could get their deposit back that the dealer put up when the bike was ordered as there was no real customer in the first place. by Tony"

True -- this happened to a local dealer already in late 2005.

MCRIDER007 Posted on Feb 20 2006, 01:07 PM

An even bigger mystery is Yamaha's allocation system for new/sport bikes. Once the decision is made to bring a model to the US, such as the new FZ1, why doesn't Yamaha produce enough bikes to meet the dealers' requests? It seems that if the dealer is willing to order/buy XX number of FZ1s then he has assumed the risk for selling them and Yamaha should be more than willing to manufature same. I would like to buy a 2006 FZ1 but none of the dealers in my area were allocated any because they didn't sell an FZ1 last year -- which means they will not sell any this year either. They used to call that Catch 22.

Because greedy dealers will overstock on FZ-1s and screw-up the U.S. market for Cypress and Yamaha in general. The same dealer mentioned above last year had non-current FZ-1s selling for less than new FZ-6s. I know, not apples & apples -- but, where did those non-currents come from? That's the problem....

 

[MCRIDER007]

Because greedy dealers will overstock on FZ-1s and screw-up the U.S. market for Cypress and Yamaha in general. The same dealer mentioned above last year had non-current FZ-1s selling for less than new FZ-6s. I know, not apples & apples -- but, where did those non-currents come from? That's the problem....

Selling non-current models at deep discounts happens in every market and usually takes $$$ out of the dealer's pocket, not the party who sold the product to the dealer. If Yamaha's concern is to avoid flooding the market, it still doesn't explain why some dealers could not get a single model.

 

[TPadden]

Here's the big but ..............

I've never bought a car or motorcycle without test riding it first. When I bought my first FZ1 two local dealers had them on the floor - one said it wasn't prepped and I would have to buy it first, the other said give him an hour to prep it and it would be good to go. Guess where I bought it???

Yeah I know it isn't easy to get a test ride - I've heard the old insurance line etc. before but after showing my driver's license (with motorcycle endorsement) and current proof of insurance that covers me on any bike I ride, as well as my age, the fact that most dealers know me, and they know that when I'm looking I usually buy .......

My bet is once I make a decision I'll be able to find a FJR; if not I the local BMW dealer HAS promised me a call and test ride on the first BMW K1200GT that he gets in.

Money talks, BS walks! B)

 

[lotecredneck]

"Correct! If the dealer does not warranty register the bike in the name of the original person the deposit is forfeited and Yamaha keeps it. This is why people that purchased one off of a dealers floor had the bike already registered in another name so the dealer could get their deposit back that the dealer put up when the bike was ordered as there was no real customer in the first place. by Tony"


I bought my 05 on the floor. I got the origin certificate or do you mean it is changing for 06? I'm confused?

I know the dealer i bought from ordered extra 06s as well. Does this mean if you buy an 06 off the floor it will be "used?" :dribble:

The MCO or certificate of origin has nothing to do with when the bike was warranty registered. Send me your VIN and I can pull the date and you can compare it to the date you actually purchased your bike. If you paid enough to the dealer he may have just forfeited the deposit, but I doubt it.

Tony Orihuela

Yamaha Sportscenter

 

[lotecredneck]

"Correct! If the dealer does not warranty register the bike in the name of the original person the deposit is forfeited and Yamaha keeps it. This is why people that purchased one off of a dealers floor had the bike already registered in another name so the dealer could get their deposit back that the dealer put up when the bike was ordered as there was no real customer in the first place. by Tony"

True -- this happened to a local dealer already in late 2005.

MCRIDER007 Posted on Feb 20 2006, 01:07 PM

An even bigger mystery is Yamaha's allocation system for new/sport bikes. Once the decision is made to bring a model to the US, such as the new FZ1, why doesn't Yamaha produce enough bikes to meet the dealers' requests? It seems that if the dealer is willing to order/buy XX number of FZ1s then he has assumed the risk for selling them and Yamaha should be more than willing to manufature same. I would like to buy a 2006 FZ1 but none of the dealers in my area were allocated any because they didn't sell an FZ1 last year -- which means they will not sell any this year either. They used to call that Catch 22.

Because greedy dealers will overstock on FZ-1s and screw-up the U.S. market for Cypress and Yamaha in general. The same dealer mentioned above last year had non-current FZ-1s selling for less than new FZ-6s. I know, not apples & apples -- but, where did those non-currents come from? That's the problem....

The problem is Yamaha has only x amount of production capability and that number is determined before the dealers have a chance to order. We are given an allocation of particular models and we can ask for additional units. If all the dealers don't take their allocation the they go into a pool and are distributed to the dealers that ask for additional units.

If the dealer didn't sell any then thay may not be allocated any. (If they wouldn't stock any of the previous models why should they get the new ones?) That doen't mean they can't get one. We have the ability to trade with dealers all across the country and this is a common practice. It just seams that most dealers don't want to beat teh bushes to obtain additonal units by simply trading units that are slow selling here for ones that you need.

 

[MCRIDER007]

The problem is Yamaha has only x amount of production capability and that number is determined before the dealers have a chance to order. We are given an allocation of particular models and we can ask for additional units. If all the dealers don't take their allocation the they go into a pool and are distributed to the dealers that ask for additional units.

Thanks for the explanation. I suspected that the production schedules were determined before the dealer shows but that seems to be backwards to the way it should be done unless it is necessary to start production before the dealer shows. The current precess seems to be creating a disconnect between demand and production.

 

[jjsC6]

The FJR has put to rest the fact that the U.S. market won't support that type of motorcycle and if hadn;t been for the PDP program we would have never known that! This program is a great platform to introduce questionable models to the U.S. market to see if there is in fact a market here to support that item.

Tony, thank you for your insight but once the market for the FJR was established, what is Yamaha's rationale to continue the PDP since neither the dealers or the customers like it?

An even bigger mystery is Yamaha's allocation system for new/sport bikes. Once the decision is made to bring a model to the US, such as the new FZ1, why doesn't Yamaha produce enough bikes to meet the dealers' requests? It seems that if the dealer is willing to order/buy XX number of FZ1s then he has assumed the risk for selling them and Yamaha should be more than willing to manufature same. I would like to buy a 2006 FZ1 but none of the dealers in my area were allocated any because they didn't sell an FZ1 last year -- which means they will not sell any this year either. They used to call that Catch 22.

Gee, that's marketing at its finest. "gee, you didn't sell any last year we are going to penalize you this year. And we're not going to give the FZ1 product manager a bonus this year because his sales were flat..."

 

[lotecredneck]

The FJR has put to rest the fact that the U.S. market won't support that type of motorcycle and if hadn;t been for the PDP program we would have never known that! This program is a great platform to introduce questionable models to the U.S. market to see if there is in fact a market here to support that item.

Tony, thank you for your insight but once the market for the FJR was established, what is Yamaha's rationale to continue the PDP since neither the dealers or the customers like it?

An even bigger mystery is Yamaha's allocation system for new/sport bikes. Once the decision is made to bring a model to the US, such as the new FZ1, why doesn't Yamaha produce enough bikes to meet the dealers' requests? It seems that if the dealer is willing to order/buy XX number of FZ1s then he has assumed the risk for selling them and Yamaha should be more than willing to manufature same. I would like to buy a 2006 FZ1 but none of the dealers in my area were allocated any because they didn't sell an FZ1 last year -- which means they will not sell any this year either. They used to call that Catch 22.

Gee, that's marketing at its finest. "gee, you didn't sell any last year we are going to penalize you this year. And we're not going to give the FZ1 product manager a bonus this year because his sales were flat..."

Why should Yamaha offer the new one to a dealer that won't buy and try to sell the previous model? They should reward the dealers that consistently buy all models available to them regardless of that units popularity and represents the full line the manufacturer offers. Instead alot of them simply want to cherry pick the lineup and then cry foul when they can't have all they want of a new model or a significantly improved model when they wouldn't support the model to begin with.

That's my take on it.....for what it's worth.

Tony

 

[TPadden]

Why should Yamaha offer the new one to a dealer that won't buy and try to sell the previous model? They should reward the dealers that consistently buy all models available to them regardless of that units popularity and represents the full line the manufacturer offers. Instead alot of them simply want to cherry pick the lineup and then cry foul when they can't have all they want of a new model or a significantly improved model when they wouldn't support the model to begin with.

Tony

.... So instead Yamaha decides to cherry pick customers by allowing only those willing to pre-order to purchase their product.

As I said I'm still fairly confident when I decide to plop down the bucks I'll be able to find a FJR - customers and dealers will always find a way to circumvent a system that even slightly restricts the free market.

The only reason I bought the ZX-6R when I really wanted a Triumph 675 was the dealer had one on the floor for me to test ride and THEN decide whether I wanted to purchase it or not. I was willing to wait but Triumph's pre-order policy just turned me off. I love the Ninja and am now glad that Triumph made my decision easier.

Damn - I was really interested in the FJR but this discussion has me leaning back into the BMW-GT camp; and it has nothing to do with the bike. <_<

 

[Bounce]

Damn - I was really interested in the FJR but this discussion has me leaning back into the BMW-GT camp; and it has nothing to do with the bike. <_<

Everyone has to do what they think makes them comfortable. Buy what you want. It's your money. Come back and let us know what it's like after you actually buy the GT. As it stands now, using it as a bargaining chip in a debate about things which none of us have direct influence over is a waste of everyone's time.

This tunes been wailed for the past 4 years. It'll change or it won't. People will participate or they won't.

 

[MCRIDER007]

Why should Yamaha offer the new one to a dealer that won't buy and try to sell the previous model? They should reward the dealers that consistently buy all models available to them regardless of that units popularity and represents the full line the manufacturer offers. Instead alot of them simply want to cherry pick the lineup and then cry foul when they can't have all they want of a new model or a significantly improved model when they wouldn't support the model to begin with.

Sorry Tony, but your last answer is total bullshit. You should know better than anyone that some models are hot is some parts of the US and totally flat in others. No dealer should be expected to stock models that just are not selling in his area. In the case of the 2006 FZ1, it has been marketed by Yamaha as a almost totally new bike, why should dealers be penalized because they were unable to sell the old one?

 

[SkooterG]

Why should Yamaha offer the new one to a dealer that won't buy and try to sell the previous model? They should reward the dealers that consistently buy all models available to them regardless of that units popularity and represents the full line the manufacturer offers. Instead alot of them simply want to cherry pick the lineup and then cry foul when they can't have all they want of a new model or a significantly improved model when they wouldn't support the model to begin with.

Sorry Tony, but your last answer is total bullshit. You should know better than anyone that some models are hot is some parts of the US and totally flat in others. No dealer should be expected to stock models that just are not selling in his area. In the case of the 2006 FZ1, it has been marketed by Yamaha as a almost totally new bike, why should dealers be penalized because they were unable to sell the old one?

Sorry MCRIDER007 (What the hell is your name anyways?) I think your post is total bullshit.

First of all, you can tone down your wording to Tony as far as I am concerned, as he really does us a service by providing information generally not available. You could have stated your opinion in a less insulting and confrontational way.

Second, WTF do you know? How is Yamaha supposed to do this? Do you have some super wisdom on this that you are not sharing with us? Frankly, it all makes sense to me. Yamaha only has so much capacity. Less capacity than demand in many instances. Which by the way, is a very smart way for them to run their business. So you tell me how they should allocate their bikes?

Why should they take away a bike from a dealer who is a proven performer every year, and give that one to a dealer who historically has not made the effort to try and sell that bike. That would not be rewarding the dealer who really makes an effort. That is not a good thing. The incentive for dealers to sell more bikes has just vanished.

And TPadden, I enjoyed our exchange yesterday, but if you are going to let this thread influence your decision on what bike you are going to buy, well then...........I really don't know what to say. Other than that is completely ridiculous.

 

[MCRIDER007]

Damn - I was really interested in the FJR but this discussion has me leaning back into the BMW-GT camp; and it has nothing to do with the bike. <_<

I can understand your frustration because I also refused to participate in the PDP (I got mine when someone wanted to back out of the PDP only 2 weeks before it was delivered) but your purchase decision should always be based on the bike and value for the $$$ involved. There are enough FJRs on the road that you should be able to get a test ride, maybe from someone on this forum, and then decide. If you can't find a new one there seem to be more and more used ones for sale, some in new condition.

 

[MCRIDER007]

Sorry MCRIDER007 (What the hell is your name anyways?)  I think your post is total bullshit. 
First of all, you can tone down your wording to Tony as far as I am concerned, as he really does us a service by providing information generally not available.  You could have stated your opinion in a less insulting and confrontational way.

Second, WTF do you know?  How is Yamaha supposed to do this?  Do you have some super wisdom on this that you are not sharing with us?  Frankly, it all makes sense to me.  Yamaha only has so much capacity.  Less capacity than demand in many instances.  Which by the way, is a very smart way for them to run their business.  So you tell me how they should allocate their bikes?

Why should they take away a bike from a dealer who is a proven performer every year, and give that one to a dealer who historically has not made the effort to try and sell that bike.  That would not be rewarding the dealer who really makes an effort.  That is not a good thing.  The incentive for dealers to sell more bikes has just vanished.

Having a bad day SkooterG? I agree that Tony's comments have been very informative and he is a valuable contributor to this forum but I think he blew it on his last post. Is bullshit too strong of word for this forum? If so, then you can edit my post but you shouldn't use it either.

WTF do I know? I know that Yamaha seems have the ability to build some great bikes but piss off both the dealers and the customers at the same time. If you think that all the various models sell equally in all areas then you are in denial. I am not sure what a proven performer really means. Every dealer wants to sell bikes but they have to make a profit doing it or they will not be in business very long. My local dealers stocked and sold FZ1s until they couldn't sell any more. Should they be expected to stock a bike that they are going to have to sell at a deep discount or loss the following year? The 2006 FZ1 is a new bike with an old name. I think Yamaha should have given each dealer an allocation of at least one if they wanted it.

That would be both good business and fair.

- Steve

 

[sparky3008]

The date is 2/21/2006, Back in 11/05 some wanted a fjr, no dealer in the world had one yet and if you wanted one you put down $500 which guaranteed you would get one. Go one with your life and when they come in you get that awesome phone call.

Now the date is 11/05 and you are interested in the new fly by wire R6, no dealer in the world has one and you must also wait until they come in. Only when they arrive at the dealer either no one calls you, you go on vacation, whatever and when you do get around to going to the dealer because they are so hot most dealers are out. This did happen to me with the GSXR 750 so speaking first hand.

Many dealers won't let you test ride these hot bikes because they well don't have to. Someone will buy them so move on.

I personally like the PDP as it means I don't have to worry about someone else getting the bike.

Now if you don't want the PDP you will still find a few sitting at dealers if you look long and hard and if that's what you like to do good for you... But you will still have to wait for April May June July any freaking way so wtf...

Now may the crying continue!!!

 

[TPadden]

And TPadden, I enjoyed our exchange yesterday, but if you are going to let this thread influence your decision on what bike you are going to buy, well then...........I really don't know what to say.  Other than that is completely ridiculous.

You guys are missing my point completely - my decision has nothing to do with Yamaha's dealer-customer relationship but everything to do with whether the bike meets my needs. I do my research - and everything I've read about the FJR indicates there is only one complaint that might effect me and that is the heat. Am I supposed to just take Yamaha's word that the problem (non-problem) is fixed and it won't effect me???? :blink: I just won't pre-order a bike that hasn't even been tested by the mags.

I read the same complaint in 02 about the FZ1 but in that case I was able to test ride it before purchase to determine that the heat really wasn't a problem for me.

As well as multiple bikes I'm retired and have a winter house in Florida so the heat is a concern. You guys are right that my decision is my decision but I appreciate your input and I will continue to do my research!

 

[sparky3008]

And TPadden, I enjoyed our exchange yesterday, but if you are going to let this thread influence your decision on what bike you are going to buy, well then...........I really don't know what to say.  Other than that is completely ridiculous.

You guys are missing my point completely - my decision has nothing to do with Yamaha's dealer-customer relationship but everything to do with whether the bike meets my needs. I do my research - and everything I've read about the FJR indicates there is only one complaint that might effect me and that is the heat. Am I supposed to just take Yamaha's word that the problem is fixed and it won't effect me???? :blink: I just won't pre-order a bike that hasn't even been tested by the mags.

I read the same complaint in 02 about the FZ1 but in that case I was able to test ride it before purchase to determine that the heat really wasn't a problem for me.

As well as multiple bikes I'm retired and have a winter house in Florida so the heat is a concern. You guys are right that my decision is my decision but I appreciate your input and I will continue to do my research!

I have ridden air cooled V-Twins with no fairings that put off just as much heat to me as the FJR.

I haven't had any issues with this at all. If I wear jeans I notice a little more heat than my Joe Rocket riding pants but again no different than any other bike I have ridden.

One thing with the fjr is since the seat pushes you into the tank you feel the heat on the tank. Many get aftermarket seats and have the maker change this angle. With the new seat adjustments you should be able to change this.

I wouldn't let this affect your decision at all... Just MHO

 

[Scab]

I agree, Sparky. If heat is the only issue with a new purchaser, then it definately is not a deal breaker. Even if Yami hasn't resolved the issue to everyone's satisfaction (which I am sure someone will be unhappy), there are only a ton of heat fixes on this forum alone!