Audiovox Cruise Control Install Help

[slapnpop]

After riding with the cruise for a few days, and reading a little more, I have a question.

With or without the canister, how many ports do you use to draw vaccum. Is there a reason they need to be isolated? Is there any reason you should NOT draw on just one?

I ask because the servo does seem a little "weak" at times, even with the disconnected middle return spring. Should I use more than one port? Should I just add the canister? do I just need to add a check valve? not sure what the best action is, but that's what I wanna do, best performance.

 

[ionbeam]

>>how many ports<< Just like 'do you need a canister' opinions vary. The purpose of the canister is to ensure that you never run out of vacuum for the CC. The diaphram in the servo is 'vented', it releases vacuum to let the throttle slow down, therefore you need a constant vacuum supply. The more ports providing vacuum to the canister the more likely to maintain sufficient vacuum. Remember the CC was designed for a car with a big intake manifold and lots of vacuum to spare.

>>Is there a reason they need to be isolated<< Yes, it keeps pressure variation in the servo from finding it's way back down to the throttle bodies. The diaphram in the servo moves alot and the check valve isolates this from the throttle bodies. Also, the check valve lets the canister or the servo have a bad day and not cause a drastic effect on the throttle bodies. The sync ports must be plugged or the vacuum leak will cause a really lean cylinder. Lean cylinders = melted metal

My OPINION is that actually each vacuum line from the throttle bodies should have a check valve. Bernoulli's principle says stuff about air speed and vacuum (details on request). The air speed in the throttle bodies creates a vacuum. The very same vacuum that everyone uses to sync the throttle bodies. Each cylinder has a different vacuum level as the result of several thing happening. Each throttle body/cylinder *should* have a different vacuum level to work best. What we have done is gang all the throttle bodies together so they work as one intake manifold.

Again, my OPINION. Yes, add a canister (see my previous post for an easy way out). Yes, use more than 1 port. Yes, use a check valve. And in my OPINION use a check valve on each cylinder.

Ok you guys that have used more than 1 port and have painstakingly synched your throttle bodies so each is really accurate, think on this: Each cylinder has an ideal setting for best air induction and fuel mixing. When we sync the throttle bodies we optimize each cylinder so that it shares an equal amount of work. Now, take the 4 throttle bodies that have been carefully optimized and join them all together so now they all share the same vacuum level. Is this a good thing?

Alan

 

[FJRocket]

One vac line and one vac port, no aux can, definetely/absolutely check valve prior to the servo. Still works great, but there is a bit of lag and seek on mine. Pretty smooth operation, though. Still two thumbs up. Oh, and throttle springs disconnected.

 

[Espia4ci]

Motorgod, after looking the pictures from your website I have a question. Is that an XM radio mounted atop your left handle bar? What type of bracket did you use?

 

[Stu64]

Are the grey and black wires for the VSS signal hooked up or just tied off?

 

[slapnpop]

Are the grey and black wires for the VSS signal hooked up or just tied off?

You do not use these wires. Hide them.

 

[Stu64]

Well then i have problems Everything seems to be wired correct and pin switches are set correct. Cruise sets and then disengages. I tried it with the vacuum canister and without. Canister still had vacuum inside when i disconnected it? All my connections are soldered too.

 

[tsitalon1]

Mine did that too on the centerstand but works great on the road.

Was this issue on the centerstand?

James

 

[Stu64]

No this is while driving it at 45mph and above.

 

[tsitalon1]

No this is while driving it at 45mph and above.

Dbl check everything! either you made a mistake or you have a defective unit.

Does the control pad light up?

James

 

[Stu64]

Control pad lights up fine. I checked all the wires with a test light while pushing the control pad buttons,checking the wires at the servo.

 

[tsitalon1]

Control pad lights up fine. I checked all the wires with a test light while pushing the control pad buttons,checking the wires at the servo.

did you use a check valve? I did not.

James

 

[RadioHowie]

This thread is EXACTLY the kind of "mod" (or "farkle", as you FJR guys call it) that I'm hoping to see LOTS of in this forum.

With community support like this, I'm getting closer to pulling the trigger on a new FJR with each passing day.

Putting a "real" cruise control on my future Feejer was right at the top of my "first farkle" list, so the details are greatly appreciated.

I love the Throttlemeister on my ZRX, but wanted something more sophisticated (and accurate) for my future purchase.

Thanks.

 

[james1300]

Change the 'dip switches'.

Stick with the 'LOW' sensitivity setting (light vehicles with high horsepower).

 

[Stu64]

Yes i used a check valve and made sure it worked, and dip switch is set for low weight/high horsepower. The ground wire show good too.

 

[ionbeam]

I don’t have access to the CC wiring diagram right now but I believe there should be 2 grounds.

Conditions where the CC will disengage:

Either brake engaged

Clutch pulled in

Sudden rapid increase in RPM (same as pulling in the clutch)

Problems reading the coil or speed sensor

Be sure you have selected the correct switch at the servo for a coil

Verify you have picked up the correct coil wire

(You did seal the control pad against moisture, right?)

CC sees a condition where vehicle response is very different from control signal. This is why the CC doesn’t work on the center stand.

More: When the cruise control is set it looks at the current pulse count at the speed signal (typically the coil on FJRs), after noting the pulse count it gradually increases pull on the throttle cable until it notes a change in pulse count, then it backs off slightly. This takes the slack out of the throttle cable and maintains your set speed. As you go up or down hill the pulse count at the coil will change with speed, the CC sees the difference between set pulse count and the current pulse count. The difference is ‘error’ from set count. The CC will pull or release the throttle cable until pulse count matches set count. Whew! How hard does the CC pull the cable? How rapidly does it release the cable? That is determined by setting the switches for light vehicle (tells the CC that the vehicle will respond rapidly) and high horse power (no need to yank hard on the throttle cable, a little tug will get good response). For you techies, his method of maintaining pulse count is known as an Error Amplifier and the method of cable control is a PID loop.

Putting it all together: The CC has been programmed to expect that when it pulls on the throttle cable with light force it will see small changes in pulse count and when it pulls hard on the cable the pulse counts will climb but will not climb instantly. Feejer has weight (mass) and the engine supplies force. No matter how much force the engine makes it takes time for it to effect mass. When Feejer is on the center stand and you set the cruise control, the CC takes a little tug on the throttle cable but because the rear wheel is in the air (no resistance) it instantly speeds up. The CC recognizes the pulse count response was WAY out of proportion to the little tug. This is an error condition and it shuts off the CC. If you were riding in the rain with the CC set and the CC tugs on the throttle cable and the rear tire slips the CC would shut off. Hopefully in time!

Alan

 

[Stu64]

I plan on checking a few things tonight.

1- The ground for the control pad,didn't check this because it's under the tank.

2- Inches of vacuum using gauge.

3-Servo operation when vacuum is applied.

I am hoping it's the ground, when i checked the wires at the servo while

pushing the buttons it seemed like the signal was weak.

 

[Stu64]

1- ground was good.

2- vacuum 15in. and over.

3- with vacuum gage teed into line between check valve and servo

15in. of vacuum and held it after shutting off bike. So no leak at servo.

Now how can i test the tach signal?? Blue wire.

 

[Stu64]

After reading the above posts i think i may know the problem,but i need to know how to fix it?

When the cruise sets, it makes the bike speed up faster(revs) than the set point

do you think the cruise is seeing this and shutting down?

 

[ionbeam]

When you bundled and stashed the VSS wires you made sure that the two wires didn't short together or to any metal parts, right?

There should be a ground wire from the servo.

There should be a ground wire from the control pad.

There should be an ignition switched power source.

DIP switch 3 is set for Tach (off if I remember correctly).

Always check for the signal on the wires from the CC system wires, don't probe into the connector. If you probe the connector you are verifying the signal is on a pin but the pin may have a bad connection to the wire. On the 8 wires you soldered that shouldn't be a problem!

Use your test light to verify that the voltage on the clutch, foot brake and hand brake actually do switch. There is an opportunity for the wiring to be wrong at the foot brake connection. The wires were a bit confusing on my ABS.

To test the tach signal haul your oscilloscope down to the bike and hook-er-up. I mean, after all, *everyone* has a 'scope or two just sitting around :bb: Anyway, moving right along... I would be afraid to put your test light on the tach signal wire, you need to use a volt meter to check the tach signal. A meter has very high resistance and your test light has low resistance which could harm the tach signal generator. Set the meter for 20 vdc scale, at idle you will see a small dc signal, as rpms climb the voltage should climb. This is only a rough check but adequate to verify that something happens as RPMs change. That is all you need to verify the connection and signal.

[The tach signal is actually a fast square wave. When the meter is set to DC scale it will show an average of the wave. As RPM climb the average will go up. If you set the meter to AC scale which would seem correct you may run into a problem with the meter. Meters can only measure AC up to a limited frequency. The limit varies with meter brand and quality. Measuring average DC is plenty good here.]

Keep after it! It will be worth it!

Alan