De-linking the '06?

[Pacman]

Say you don't like the linking of the brakes. Would you be able to come up with a set of lines to "delink" it? I've noticed in some pics that the front right caliper has two lines/banjos into it. Do we know if there is a "modulator" as in cars, that applies the rear caliper a fraction of a second before the front as to control the diving on the forks?

Don't know.... never had an ABS bike but I do like the idea. Not so sure about the "linking" thing... I use both brakes quite often (please don't go on a shpeal about rear brake usage...) and I don't know that I'd like the bike applying them for me.....

Just thinking....

 

[downn2(aka starcruiser)]

Man, you do a lot of thinking......Well give this some thought....

You never ever want to make any kind of modification to an ABS braking system, nor on a bike's braking system that's not ABS for that matter.....I'm sure your attorney will confer with me on this line of logical thinking...

What it boils down to is....if you want to be able to STOP AS FAST AS POSSIBLE have ABS.....if your life isn't that important and you'd rather save the cash, buy a bike without it......

 

[panthercity]

....if you want to be able to STOP AS FAST AS POSSIBLE have ABS...

Uh, no.

 

[Pacman]

Man, you do a lot of thinking......Well give this some thought....
You never ever want to make any kind of modification to an ABS braking system, nor on a bike's braking system that's not ABS for that matter.....I'm sure your attorney will confer with me on this line of logical thinking...

What it boils down to is....if you want to be able to STOP AS FAST AS POSSIBLE have ABS.....if your life isn't that important and you'd rather save the cash, buy a bike without it......

Thanks for the legal/red print/safety issues. Now anybody care to comment about FACTS with these type of brakes?

BTW Mr.downn2 "De-linking" has been done to Moto Guzzis for years!

 

[tripletango]

Man,  you do a lot of thinking......Well give this some thought....
You never ever want to make any kind of modification to an ABS braking system, nor on a bike's braking system that's not ABS for that matter.....I'm sure your attorney will confer with me on this line of logical thinking...

What it boils down to is....if you want to be able to STOP AS FAST AS POSSIBLE have ABS.....if your life isn't that important and you'd rather save the cash, buy a bike without it......

Thanks for the legal/red print/safety issues. Now anybody care to comment about FACTS with these type of brakes?

BTW Mr.downn2 "De-linking" has been done to Moto Guzzis for years!

I heard that the rear lever starts to apply the pressure to one rotor of the front using only 2 of the 6 calipers at 40% of max application pressure.

So you can put pretty hefty pressure on the rear brake and leave the front out of it by modulating pressure yourself.

 

[madmike2]

Obviously, delinking has been done to other makes and models, i.e., Guzzis and Blackbirds. Certainly someone will come up with the modification, but until a mechanical wizard actually sees the Yamaha version of linked brakes, all is conjecture.

Personally, I'd wait and see how the system works and reacts, keeping the plans to de-link on the back burner, on simmer.

In other words, "Patience, Grasshopper."

 

[twowheelnut]

I'll throw in...

Linked brakes on road bikes good. Save lots of racer poseur ass.

Linked brakes on race bikes bad. Screw up turn-in and makes trail braking all but impossible.

Had I not so heavily invested in friggin' farkles on my '05, non-ABS, you can bet your ARMCO wearin' ass that I'd have a deposit in on an '06 A model.

 

[3dogs]

Without giving away my age, this thread reminds me of when electroic ignition was first introduced in about 1975. Prior to that, almost everything, 2 and 4 wheels, had points and condensor. I remember that many owners (mostly of cars/trucks but some motorcycles) had the electronic distributors converted back to points. This way every 3000 miles they had to be adjusted and the engine still had same cold-starting problems experienced for the last 75 years.

Yamaha is doing us all a favor by providing ABS and even linked brakes. 95% of street riders will stop in a shorter distance with this technology. Sure the braking distance numbers published in MCN or other magazines for ABS/Linked brakes are slightly longer than conventional braking systems but that is because the "tester" knows how to stop (on dry, clean pavement) with out locking up the front/rear tires.

I spent many sessions with MCN in the CA desert working the radar gun and watching and learing how to make fast stops. I've been riding for almost 40 years and I still could not equal the stopping distances of even the ABS bikes, let alone those with conventional braking systems. The only riders that can stop faster than ABS/linked brakes have had extensive race track experience. Remember that the race tracks normally don't have oil, leaves, sand, anti-freeze, gravel dear ****, etc... on them. On the street--you can ride over almost anything when you apply the brakes.

If you're going to "de-link" this new FJR braking system why stop there? Get a set of carburetors, a set of dual-points and some old ignition coils and change everything out all at the same time. Throw away those radial tires and get some good bias-ply--they'll last over 15,000 miles with almost no tread wear. These changes will allow your new FJR to perform as well as any motorcycle manufactured in 1975 and you can sell all the replaced parts on eBay.

 

[panthercity]

If you're going to "de-link" this new FJR braking system why stop there? Get a set of carburetors, a set of dual-points and some old ignition coils and change everything out all at the same time. Throw away those radial tires and get some good bias-ply--they'll last over 15,000 miles with almost no tread wear. These changes will allow your new FJR to perform as well as any motorcycle manufactured in 1975 and you can sell all the replaced parts on eBay.

You left out the kick start! Don't forget the kick start!!!

 

[SkooterG]

Without giving away my age, this thread reminds me of when electroic ignition was first introduced in about 1975. Prior to that, almost everything, 2 and 4 wheels, had points and condensor. I remember that many owners (mostly of cars/trucks but some motorcycles) had the electronic distributors converted back to points. This way every 3000 miles they had to be adjusted and the engine still had same cold-starting problems experienced for the last 75 years.
Yamaha is doing us all a favor by providing ABS and even linked brakes. 95% of street riders will stop in a shorter distance with this technology. Sure the braking distance numbers published in MCN or other magazines for ABS/Linked brakes are slightly longer than conventional braking systems but that is because the "tester" knows how to stop (on dry, clean pavement) with out locking up the front/rear tires.

I spent many sessions with MCN in the CA desert working the radar gun and watching and learing how to make fast stops. I've been riding for almost 40 years and I still could not equal the stopping distances of even the ABS bikes, let alone those with conventional braking systems. The only riders that can stop faster than ABS/linked brakes have had extensive race track experience. Remember that the race tracks normally don't have oil, leaves, sand, anti-freeze, gravel dear ****, etc... on them. On the street--you can ride over almost anything when you apply the brakes.

If you're going to "de-link" this new FJR braking system why stop there? Get a set of carburetors, a set of dual-points and some old ignition coils and change everything out all at the same time. Throw away those radial tires and get some good bias-ply--they'll last over 15,000 miles with almost no tread wear. These changes will allow your new FJR to perform as well as any motorcycle manufactured in 1975 and you can sell all the replaced parts on eBay.

+1

He he he he..... :lol:

Well said. But besides the kick start, you forgot the spoked wheels with integral drum brake, and inner tubes for the tires.

 

[FJRottie]

I am sure that a few 06 owners will tackle de-linking.

I am not a fan of it either. I like anything good, but all that does is apply brakes just as fast as I can. Linked brakes are not faster. They are just linked.

When the front brake is applied, all 4 - LHS front caliper pistons are activated, while only the "upper two" pistons on the RHS front caliper are activated. When applying the rear brake, both rear caliper pistons are activated plus the "two lower" pistons on the front RHS caliper are activated.

My foot does not move slower than my hand or vice versa.

I do brake just before a corner and may use the rear in the corner. Linked brakes bad for me.

If you want it/like it, have at it, make yourself happy.

Anxious to here what the 06 owners say after they have had it, and about the ease or pain of de-linking.

 

[twowheelnut]

I do brake just before a corner and may use the rear in the corner. Linked brakes bad for me.

Both my Gold Wing and VFR were non-ABS with linked brakes. Never once did tapping the brakes for corner entry cause issues. Indeed, the linked brakes allowed me to get hard on the brakes prior to entry to a point that I cannot match on the FJR. Braking through the corner was a comfy experience too, as you experience little brake dive that may cause your chassis to get unsettled. And never once did I lock a rear wheel with the LBS bikes even when trying. With the FJR, if I sneeze with my foot on the brake, the rear will lock up.

 

[Pacman]

Well... lets get it on!

I'm 40 years old riding since I was 13. A lot of dirt in the first 7 years or so.

If de-linking reminds you of going back to points from e-ignition.... can't help you there!

Yamaha doing us a favour? Thank you very much Yamaha. So I guess I might be part of the 5%.

Personally I couldn't care less about braking distance numbers published by anybody. I brake front only. Back half a second first and then handful of front,. Or even feather the rear only when I'm too hot into the turn to settle the bike and tuck it in further so I don't go wide. See, in those instances, hitting the front strightens up the bike, makes you go straight and agricultural you go! So I don't need a linked system applying any front brake in that instance !

As far as MCN "braking test", in the middle of the desert.... Sorry! I don't live nor do I ride in the middle of the desert. If fact, I've never been to a desert.

Been to the race track plenty though!

You know, these I'm up on the pulpit giving you my shpeal about what's right and wrong gets old. BTW, I didn't even state I was going to do it. I might like it once I've got the bike and in that case I'd leave it well enough alone! All I was asking was if it was doable.

NOthing personal here. It's just that the question was very precise. "Would you be able to come up....?"

Question wasn't SHOULD I or even IS IT RIGHT TO?

I guess the answer to my question is that if it's been done to the blackbird is probably doable on the FJR. Modulator or not. It's a free Country. Do whatever the hell you want to do !

Thanks!

 

[donaldb]

My neighbor's 1150Rt has both linked and servo assisted breaks, the linked part is ok, can take it or leave it, I don't, cant, wont ride ever at a level--given my age and prior history--that having linked breaks would ever cause me any problems or concerns--but what I despise is the servo assisted breaks at slow parkinglot speeds. Talking about dumping a bike--geez--those things snatch so bad as slow speeds that I wont ride my neighbors bike anymore--and even though his breaks are ABS as well, I wouldn't recommend you reach up and grab a handful of break--it will still throw you over the front of the bike, it damn near happened to me. When you are use to standard breaks or even ABS as mine is, those servo breaks take a LOT of getting use to--different strokes for different folks! No thank you!

 

[shuswaper]

For what it`s worth: 3dog and 2wheel are right on the money with this one. As for the others: it`s crazy to be talking about d-linking what the manufacturers have engineered to be an important safety issue, for all but the expert racers that is. Nevermind the fact that nobody has ridden the `06 yet. If you do some unbiased research on the subject, I am sure you will find the concept of linked brakes, in terms of the most recent developments in technology and execution, to be quite sound! I for one, welcome advancement in all areas and the majority of us are better off as a result! Cheers... :assasin:

 

[FJRottie]

I am sure you will find the concept of linked brakes, in terms of the most recent developments in technology and execution, to be quite sound!

No I don't. Cheers.

 

[slapnpop]

And what about those of us unfortunate enough to have to ride the FJR in gravel on a daily basis. The parking lot at work is not level, and ****** loose gravel. If I even touch the front brake in the parking lot the nose dives and the bike instantly stops. I then have to roll the front out of a 3" trough in the gravel. If I had linked brakes, every time I hit the rear brake the front wheel would dive into the gravel and I'd be at a stop, not slowing down. This is one instance (which I have to deal with regularly) where I would want my brakes de-linked.

Of course I ride an '03 with no ABS and nothing even resembling linked brakes, and this isn't going to change any time soon. You guys do what you want.

 

[twowheelnut]

And what about those of us unfortunate enough to have to ride the FJR in gravel on a daily basis.  The parking lot at work is not level, and ****** loose gravel.  If I even touch the front brake in the parking lot the nose dives and the bike instantly stops.  I then have to roll the front out of a 3" trough in the gravel.  If I had linked brakes, every time I hit the rear brake the front wheel would dive into the gravel and I'd be at a stop, not slowing down.  This is one instance (which I have to deal with regularly) where I would want my brakes de-linked.
Of course I ride an '03 with no ABS and nothing even resembling linked brakes, and this isn't going to change any time soon.  You guys do what you want.

I rode the VFR on a loooooonngg gravel road once (don't ask, it wasn't planned :blink: ). Lots of nasty downhill, hairpin turns. Never a problem. The only time when anyone would not feel joy-joy on a bike with linked brakes would be on the track, running 10/10th's.

Anyone know if WC disabled them on his XX?

 

[Warchild]

I would also be de-linking if I were to have this bike.

There's little danger of that happening, though, so it's a moot point for me, personally.

I would have de-linked the Blackbird long ago, but the Honda LBS system is much more complex that the Yamaha setup. There are nine different lines on the XX; that system is linked mechanically, not hydraulically. The de-linking kit on the Blackbird is pretty spending compared to what will be a trivial de-linking kit the aftermarket will inevitably bring to the '06 FJRs.

Agreed that the majority of FJR owners wouldn't care (or hardly noticed) that the bike has linked brakes. Some will, however.