Going to the Dark Side

[Fred W]

2 comments:

1) It's really hard to read your posts when you insert such large images. Can you try to resize them in future posts? If you need a tool to resize images on a windows machine, try Irfanview. Freeware. Very simple and easy.

2) I am surprised at how little of the sidewall you hit on your test ride.

 

[user 213]

2 comments:
1) It's really hard to read your posts when you insert such large images. Can you try to resize them in future posts? If you need a tool to resize images on a windows machine, try Irfanview. Freeware. Very simple and easy.

2) I am surprised at how little of the sidewall you hit on your test ride.

I'll see what I can do about the pics. New camera, and I lost access to the software I had for re-sizing when I changed PCs. I'll check out Irfanview. (edit- fixed the last post pics, will do the rest tonight. Thanks for mentioning it FredW)

The bike never goes up on the side walls, no matter how far you lean over. That's one of the things that is hard for people to grasp until they see it. I am leaning over just as much as with a moto tire, (for me), but the CT design does not allow you off the tread portion of the tire.

Another description of handling that occurred to me. With new moto tires, like Storms, you can just think about turning and you initiate turn in and start going that way. With the CT, you always need to make a conscious bar input to initiate a turn. It's not that it's difficult to do, just that there is more of a propensity to go strait, whereas the moto tires when new are excellent at moving easily off center into turns.

 

[SouthernCruizer]

Congratulations on still being alive after that test ride. I feel the same everytime I land my Cardinal or Powrachute 2000...damn miracle!! <_<

Anxious to hear more about the tire after you get a couple of more rides in. I may end up on the dark side! Most of my riding is distance and being in the flat lands of South Louisiana, not much twisty worries here. Thanks for keeping us posted!

 

[RadioHowie]

OC,
Iffin' I drags my Feej over, will you mount one of those on him? I'd love a 30,000 mile rear tire!

All the info will be posted here. If you want the shop name that mounted the tire, PM me and I'll be glad to give it to you. I'd say watch this space and see what I report before you jump on the bandwagon.

Oh trust me...I'm following this thread with the GREATEST of interest.

 

[Fred W]

The bike never goes up on the side walls, no matter how far you lean over. That's one of the things that is hard for people to grasp until they see it. I am leaning over just as much as with a moto tire, (for me), but the CT design does not allow you off the tread portion of the tire.

I didn't really mean the sidewalls, so much as the corner of the tread. It really doesn't seem like you went up on the corner very much. Maybe due to your self proclaimed "easy riding style"?

But it makes me think, if during spirited cornering the main flat part of the tire tread actually lifts off the ground (as can be seen in the Utube videos), and you end up riding primarily on the corner part of the (essentially) square tire tread, why wouldn't that corner area wear out prematurely.

I guess a lot will depend on the individual and their particular mix of road types and how aggressively they ride through the corners. For instance, my last rear was a Pirelli Strada (non-E code). Almost everyone complains that they get no warning with that particular rear tire before they see cords. For me, this was absolutely no problem as I wore the tread pattern of the sides and still had a healthy center strip left. I now have a Roadsmart on there w/ ~4k on it, and I think I'm probably going to end up in the same situation. So for a rider like me it may not even make sense to buy the (more expensive) dual compound tires if I'm wearing out the sides before the center. Either that or having the harder center stripe may be what allows me to fully wear the sides out before having to change the tire. Not sure.

But I think you can see where I'm going with this. Some riders might mount up an expensive CT and then wear the corners off of it long before the center gets worn at all.

 

[dkbellga]

Wow, as an engineer, it just seems strange to invest in a high performance motorcycle, then weaken the sole element of delivery of that performance. But I do understand your motives, and commend you for knowing what you want and going after it. You seem to have demonstrated a lot of self-confidence and honesty by making your sins, I mean your experiment public on this board. I encourage you to keep it honest whether or not it works, so all can benefit...but I'm sure you'll do that.

Keep it safe OC, and good luck,

 

[SouthernCruizer]

Wow, as an engineer, it just seems strange to invest in a high performance motorcycle, then weaken the sole element of delivery of that performance. But I do understand your motives, and commend you for knowing what you want and going after it. You seem to have demonstrated a lot of self-confidence and honesty by making your sins, I mean your experiment public on this board. I encourage you to keep it honest whether or not it works, so all can benefit...but I'm sure you'll do that.
Keep it safe OC, and good luck,

*********************************

Hmmm...how can an engineer only focus on the SPORT/tourer part of that designation, as per your "...then weaken the SOLE element..."?? Seems like you'd be thinking 50/50 on the sport vs tourer attributes of the FJR. Seems to me that using your logic, either a person would set up the FJR for either sport or tourer, with no in-between. Sport riders would take off the bags, take off any unnecessary weight, change to sport tires, file down wind screen, etc. Tourer riders would only add cup holders, GPS's, long range tires, comfy heavy seats, etc.

I think OC is searching for things that make the bike rideable within his envelope of use. Touring is within that envelope if you believe the sport/tourer designation that Yamaha attached to it.

Keep on experimenting! :yahoo:

 

[DaveFJR]

I think MC tire manufacturer's don't make a tire that can last 20,000 miles because there must not be enough motorcyclists demanding longer mileage touring tires. I typically get 8000 - 10000 miles on crusier, standard, and sport touring tires but the latest & greatest MC tires still return about the same mileage that I got 20yrs ago.

Using car tires is not for me but I find this is an interesting experiment. Perhaps you can post how far above the posted corner speed you feel comfortable with this set-up. I think most people rarely follow a 30 mph limit on corners with no traffic under good conditions.

 

[dkbellga]

Wow, as an engineer, it just seems strange to invest in a high performance motorcycle, then weaken the sole element of delivery of that performance. But I do understand your motives, and commend you for knowing what you want and going after it. You seem to have demonstrated a lot of self-confidence and honesty by making your sins, I mean your experiment public on this board. I encourage you to keep it honest whether or not it works, so all can benefit...but I'm sure you'll do that.
Keep it safe OC, and good luck,

*********************************

Hmmm...how can an engineer only focus on the SPORT/tourer part of that designation, as per your "...then weaken the SOLE element..."?? Seems like you'd be thinking 50/50 on the sport vs tourer attributes of the FJR. Seems to me that using your logic, either a person would set up the FJR for either sport or tourer, with no in-between. Sport riders would take off the bags, take off any unnecessary weight, change to sport tires, file down wind screen, etc. Tourer riders would only add cup holders, GPS's, long range tires, comfy heavy seats, etc.

I think OC is searching for things that make the bike rideable within his envelope of use. Touring is within that envelope if you believe the sport/tourer designation that Yamaha attached to it.

Keep on experimenting! :yahoo:

"sole element" being the connection to the road....doesn't matter what your machine is capable of if it's only connection to the pavement is compromised. From the sport/tourer perspective, the FJR is definitely biased to the sport side of the equation. Many of the design decisions are made to optimize the sport, and compromise the tourer aspect - that's why they can sell STs out there (as in, some people want more TOURER than sport).

One thing that makes motorcycles so much fun is tweaking them to fit our personalities, priorities, styles etc., which is what OC is doing, so that's cool. One thing that makes this forum so much fun, is all of the opinions and perspectives that are shared.

So, just sayin'....it's like the "convert to chain drive" folks. Rather than go de-engineering a mechanical wonder, why not start with a machine that is designed the way you want?

It's all good.

 

[v65]

Why not start with a machine that is designed the way you want?

The FJR is considered by some to be the long distance machine of choice. For that kind of duty the car tire seems appropriate enough.

 

[user 213]

Wow, as an engineer, it just seems strange to invest in a high performance motorcycle, then weaken the sole element of delivery of that performance. <snip>

Well, I can see your point of view. Same can be said for the wheelie boys. Ya gotta wonder.

I rather disagree on it weakening the element of delivery though. In most cases, for me, I've got more rubber on the road, rather than less. Methinks you make an assumption based on your point of view, rather than factual data.

For reference, I ride with a Russell Day Long seat and a 4.8 gal fuel cell, so I'm not really looking at the FJR as a "high performance motorcycle" in the same sense as the twisty seeking hoons might.

 

[RadioHowie]

Wow, as an engineer, it just seems strange to invest in a high performance motorcycle, then weaken the sole element of delivery of that performance. <snip>

For reference, I ride with a Russell Day Long seat and a 4.8 gal fuel cell, so I'm not really looking at the FJR as a "high performance motorcycle" in the same sense as the twisty seeking hoons might.

Gunny!!

In the same vein, for my usage, my FJR is my daily driver, not some high-priced, high-performance weapon I take out on weekends for a quick scoot through the twisties with visions of Valentino Rossi coursing through my mind.

Could I have settled for a less capable motorcycle as a "daily driver"? Well, sure, but if I drove a cage as a daily driver, I guess I could settle for a Hyundai.

I chose the FJR for its weather protection, carrying capacity, great looks, quality fit and finish, dealership network, brand reputation AND for a performance envelope I NEVER will explore.

Some people choose Hyundais for their daily drivers...others choose Mercs, Acuras and Bimmers. But I bet even the Acura drivers would appreciate tires that didn't wear out in 2-3 months. :blink:

 

[dkbellga]

Methinks you make an assumption based on your point of view, rather than factual data.

I HATE it when I do that!

You'd think I'd stop doing it :blink:

 

[HaulinAshe]

...For reference, I ride with a Russell Day Long seat and a 4.8 gal fuel cell, so I'm not really looking at the FJR as a "high performance motorcycle" in the same sense as the twisty seeking hoons might.

Now now. Take it easy on the name calling!

Us "Hoons" have not called you car tire running folks any names.

My home location requires me to burn about 600 miles off a tire, just getting to/from the good mountains. So I'm in that wonderful predicament of needing mileage for the slab time and "hoonability" for the twisties. It's probably that along with the 40-grit aggregate on local roads that makes me a "tire tester".

Here's wishing you luck with your experiment. I have to express some genuine concern over what might happen when you have to do the quick obstacle avoidance maneuver required when one encounters BouncingBambi, RunningRover, CellPhoneMuffy, or TurnLeftGranny.

Good luck, ride safe!

 

[Fred W]

Now now. Take it easy on the name calling!Us "Hoons" have not called you car tire running folks any names.

Hoons unite! (no union dues required)

 

[jwhite518]

I've been giving Eric some grief over on that other list, but now it's time to say I respect what he's doing. This sport (and I mean endurance riding, not sport touring) was invented by pioneers. The early guys who ran the Iron Butt Rally, the people who first put a fuel cell on a bike, the people who started the first rallies in Nevada, the first guy who ran back to back BBGs, the first guy who ran back to back BBGs for a week (now THAT's fucking nuts)...all those people are visionary pioneers. I owe my entire endurance career to those guys because I am NOT a pioneer, but a follower.

So, Mr. OCFjr, you go. Figure out how to make the car tire work on your FJR. We need people like you.

Even if you are a dickhead for corrupting a wonderful bike.

 

[user 213]

I chose the FJR for its weather protection, carrying capacity, great looks, quality fit and finish, dealership network, brand reputation AND for a performance envelope I NEVER will explore.

Besides, you don't meet the minimum age requirement for a Gold Wing.



Nor do I. And heck, I really don't want 900 lbs of bike under me at this point in my life. I am not a slow rider, smooth is fast. I simply don't hammer out of the corners or ride like it's a track day. I've never turned around and ridden back over some twisties, just because it was fun. Well, ok, the Spiral Hwy out of Lewiston/Clarkston doesn't count. B)

 

[user 213]

Even if you are a dickhead for corrupting a wonderful bike.

Hey, hey, hey! That's "a dickhead that's scored better than me in multiple rallies corrupting a wonderful bike"

:drinks:

 

[Fred W]

I've never turned around and ridden back over some twisties, just because it was fun.

What? Never? Oh come on now...

Well, ok, the Spiral Hwy out of Lewiston/Clarkston doesn't count. B)

Oh... thank goodness. I was starting to thing you were just a soccer Mom.

PS - Puckered Sphincter (North) route at EOM did that over the route 10 section by default (thank goodness). What a magnificent section of road. Maybe if I rode it 4-5 more times I'd have found the optimum groove...

 

[user 213]

Now now. Take it easy on the name calling!Us "Hoons" have not called you car tire running folks any names.

I was under the impression that the term 'hoon' was an honorable one bestowed upon riders that sought out the twisty roads. No slight was implied. Now 'squid', that's a slight. :lol:

<snip>Here's wishing you luck with your experiment. I have to express some genuine concern over what might happen when you have to do the quick obstacle avoidance maneuver required when one encounters BouncingBambi, RunningRover, CellPhoneMuffy, or TurnLeftGranny.

Good luck, ride safe!

Thank you, thank you very much. And I encountered the PullOutInFrontofYou soccer mom already. I did what I always do, and it was a non event. Yes, the handling is different. But all the familiar moves still work as advertised. People do seem to not tailgate me as much now...... Ya think they know I'm nuts? Maybe the CT is like a sign?

:crazy: :twitchsmile: