Jumped from the Honda ST1300 to the FJR ?

[Joe Armato]

GreyGoose:

Real good comparison. As a person seriously considering the purchase of a bigger sport tourer than my VFR,

I need this type of info to help with my decision.

I really like the ST, but in my mind, it takes a back seat to the FJR. What makes things even better is

that when I sell my VFR, I may actually be able to go into a Yamaha dealer and buy a new Feejer.

The "specail order program" they used in past years left much to be desired. I think that they lost

some sales because of it.

Joe

 

[DBones]

Many many thanks all. Super replies. I especially appreciate those riders who have owned/ridden both the FJR and ST and their helpful comments.

One more question. I failed to mention earlier that the biggest deal (and ball) breaker with the ST1300 is the heat. IF not for that problem I would likely keep and thoroughly enjoy the bike for many more years. Can you tell me how much difference I'd feel between my '05 ST1300 and an '06 or later FJR? Did Yamaha get it right with the heat fixes??

Thanks again,

D Bones

 

[War Machine]

Also, anyone who made the move from the Honda ST to the FJR, and if so, how would you compare their strengths and weaknesses (particularly when looking at '06 and newer FJRs).D Bones

My buddy John owns an 04 ST & I own an 06 FJR & we share the same garage. Both of us before purchasing our bikes took many demo rides on sport tourers at Americade for several years to get "real" saddle time before buying our bikes.

Since he bought his bike before me I got to spend extended saddle time on his bike before I bought mine. These two bikes are sport tourers (DUH!) & the best way to simplify comparison is:

The Honda leans more towards the touring side of sport touring.

The Yamaha leans more towards the sporty side of sport touring.

I have ridden his bike at some insane speeds & found it to be very capable. It is not a pig as others have stated. But my FJR is better. Straightaways & twisties. But not by as large a margin as many on this website would want you to believe! But it stills does it better...for me.

I too have stated that the ST suffers from being too Vanilla. I like Vanilla...just not everyday. John put a pair of Staintune slipons & now you have Vanilla Fudge....yummy! The front wheel is still a little too neutral for me, I like a little more feedback on that important patch of road/tire.

The Honda inspires a little more confidence for an unfamilar rider more easily. The FJR is edgier & will make you pay for inexperience. Just see all the posts regarding new FJR riders going down as proof.

John (ex militaryman) likes to take everything with him in his bags. I (urban streetfighter) like riding without my bags. It all comes down to personal preference when deciding which of these 2 bikes to buy.

Do you like more touring in your sport touring or more sport! Only you can decide that!

 

[madmike2]

Can you tell me how much difference I'd feel between my '05 ST1300 and an '06 or later FJR? Did Yamaha get it right with the heat fixes??
Thanks again,

D Bones

Every owner I've talked with who traded up from an older iteration of the FJR to the new-gen ('06 +) say the heat/air management has been corrected and that the newer are very much cooler than the older style fairings.

As to how that compares to the ST1300....someone post up and answer this question.

 

[GreyGoose]

Many many thanks all. Super replies. I especially appreciate those riders who have owned/ridden both the FJR and ST and their helpful comments.
One more question. I failed to mention earlier that the biggest deal (and ball) breaker with the ST1300 is the heat. IF not for that problem I would likely keep and thoroughly enjoy the bike for many more years. Can you tell me how much difference I'd feel between my '05 ST1300 and an '06 or later FJR? Did Yamaha get it right with the heat fixes??

Thanks again,

D Bones

Well, here i go again:

Everyone will probably run me out of town for this, but here goes:

Heat: This is such a bizarre topic cause it tends to deal with what you've ridden in the past. I've never experiened a heat "issue" on any motorcycle i've ridden in the past 30 years (except the st1300 and FJR). So when i started getting cooked, i was pretty damn sensative to it. If your background is on a bike that puts off little to no heat (like my old st1100), you will think the 06 FJR runs hot. If you've just gotten off an old Vmax, you wont think twice about any "heat issues". As i stated before, the st1300 was just ridiculously hot. The difference is that the heat coming off the 06 FJR is very warm, while the heat coming off the st13 is flat out uncomfortable. The heat on the 06 FJR is also much more noticable as the windscreen is adjusted up. The higher up the screen, the more heat seems to get transmitted to the rider. With the screen in its starting position, I would say that yamaha did an outstanding job of reducing the amount of heat transmitted to the rider. As the screen comes up (and the tempuratures are 74 degrees or above), you start getting some pretty warm air (but very tolerable) on your shins and inner thighs. Its more noticable in city driving, but not much of an issue on the highway. This makes alot of sense since The yamaha upgrades are dependent upon airflow. The more airflow, the better there designed fixes work. I didnt know where to begin fixing the st1300's heat. i had heat on my ankles, shins, calves, inner thighs, and family jewels. I could "cool the jewels' quite a bit by keeping the gas tank full (which negated the benefits of that monster gas tank). ST13 would produce Hot relentless heat when the tempuratures outside reached 78 degrees and didnt matter if your in the city or the highway. I actually feel heat sooner on the FJR (74 degrees), but not that hot uncomfortable st13 heat. On hot humid days, driving around the city, i expect to be a little hot. But once i get out on the highway, i expect things to cool down. The st13 was relentless...The 06 FJR fixes work as designed. My plan is to get a larger shield to increase my wind protection while the shields in its lowest position (where the designed heat fixes seem to work there best). That way i get reduced heat coupled with less noise. Bottom line: The 06 heat fixes really work. but remember, you sitting on a 145 horsepower rocket. Its gonna get warm. I also got the chance to ride an 04 FJR and found it too be much hotter (but still better than the st13) than my 06. The guy i swapped with (pappy) agreed wholeheartadly (and is currently looking to sell his 04 for an 06).

This subject really got "my panties in a bunch" when honda refused to recognize the issue. Its truly a statement from honda about how they feel about there sport touring members. I'd make a nice wager that if this problem was happening on a gold wing, bikes would be getting recalled. The st1300 will get a make over soon (2009-2010), i'd bet 10 to 1 odds they'll be touting some new system that "increases rider comfort by decreaseing the amount of heat transmitted to the rider". We can then hopefully put that famous phrase "What heat problem!!!" to rest......

I'll shut up now..

Greygoose

 

[brianm767]

WOW! seek and ye shall find, I came to this web sight to ask a few questions about comparing the ST to the FJR, I've been wanting to purchase a sport tourer for several years now but I've allways held off for one reason or another,

My neighbor wanted to get back into riding after being off bikes for ten years or so, he told me what he wanted out of a bike so I suggsted the ST and the FJR, he said which one would you buy? I said well for me I would probably go with the ST, but for your use I would go with the FJR, well now that I've seen him riding his new 06 FJR it started the fire in me again for an S/Ting bike. I have test ridden both bikes and to me the Yamaha just plane vibrates, I did'nt notice the heat on the Honda, probaby because of the time of year I rode it? well I havnt ridden either of bikes in a few years so when my neighbor asked if I wanted to take his FJR out I couldnt resist, and even three years later I just think it vibrates too much at 65 to 75 MPH , but other than that it rocks! great power, lots of TQ. and very comfy too and it still looks sexy! to me the St is just plain FUGLY!

I recently sold my Hayabusa after a five year love affair and 24,000 miles,and I can tell you, teh Busa's vibrate, I rode a CBR1100XX before I got the Busa and I also bought another Blackbird about a year ago, so I had both super bikes, at the same time,and teh Blackbirs will also roast your legs and crotch! the tank and frame rails get very hot to touch, I still own a Blackbird and I'm looking for a bike my wife and I can ride on day or week end trips over to the coast, probably around 300 to 400 miles in a day, my wife rides a 05 F4I but she only goes out for short little rides, no way would she ever ride 150 miles over to the coast, and I just cant take her weight on my wrist for that long on the Blackbird, so which bike shoud I buy? FJR or ST???

Well here's my reasoning, tell me if I'm wrong, I plan on keeping my Blackbird, I want a bike for mostly two up riding, I dont like the Vibrations on the FJR and the ST seemed butter smooth to me, the heat might be a problem in the middle of summer on the ST, but it might also be nice when it's cold out? bottom line is I think the ST will be more comfortable on long trips than the FJR and yes less sporty? I still have the Blackbird for sport riding and I can't afford a Goldwing so thats why I put a deposit on a new 05 ST in a red just like my XX this morning, the only bad thing is it's not a ABS model which I would prefer but honestly it's not in the budget, it's going to be $12,500 OTD and it has a three year warranty, the best price I can find on a 07 FJR is $14,999 OTD with the standard 1 yr warranty.

If I could only own one Sport touring bike it would be the FJR, but since I have the Blackbird, I'm going with the ST am I wrong?????????

FJR Pros

Sexy

Power

TQ

Handling

Standard ABS

looks great bagless

FJR Cons

Price

Vibrations

Vibrations

ST's pros

Price

Comfort

Lack of vibrations

If ya drop it, bumpers do a great job protecting the plastic, I've seen it done.

Honda quality and service,

3 yr warranty

ST's Cons

Heat!!

Fugly! dont even think about running it bagless

Non ABS on the one I plan on buying.

 

[madmike2]

You have to make your own decision. In the end, you are the one writing the check and having to look in our garage.

Vibration? Yes, there is the 4-cyl. harmonic. Most owners who are sensitive to it use heavier bar-end weights and larger grips (like Hush Puppies foam grips installed over the stockers). It can be ameliorated but not eliminated..IF you are sensitive to it. I have the beginnings of Carpal Tunnel and my right wrist bothers me occaisionally so I use a throttle lock so I can remove my hand and stretch my wrist. I am now on my second FJR because I am able to ease the issue for me.

Edit: If vibrations are that big an issue for you then your decision is made. The ST is rumored to be butter-smooth. Your issue will then become heat management.

Good luck on whatever you buy. I modified every bike I've owned because of "some" issue. Its all about the ride and the smiles.

 

[Penforhire]

I'd say if you wear riding pants then don't even worry about the '05 FJR's heat. It is a non-issue unless I only wear jeans (just about never). My buddy's ST is hotter-to-the-rider (and hotter by thermocouple) and seriously roasts one leg (he added wind deflectors just to cool this area).

I traded off on my buddy's ST a couple of times and there are a couple of noticeable differences. The ST's riding position is more touring (straighter back), even with bar risers on my FJR. I think his ST has more cornering clearance and drops into turns easier, despite weighing more. Neither of us ride "at the limit" so the extra weight doesn't seem to hurt the ST. The ST's engine definitely runs out of steam too early. I'm thinking the party is just getting started and the engine tells me I need to upshift. Since switching to the ST, he is the camel-rider of our group with the longest range to empty. I give him a hard time because he has to fill with Premium while FJR's take Regular octane.

The tupperware is annoying to remove on both bikes. Honda did a better job of hiding fasteners but the FJR's oil filter is more accessible.

 

[BentAero]

I just sold my '04 ST1300A that I put over 34K miles on. The buyer rode it away Friday afternoon.

I only have 200 miles exp on a '05 FJR, and 320 on my '07A, but I can already say this: If your riding tastes run more to the sporty side, go w/ the Feejer. If they stay more on the sedate side, go w/ the ST.

Just picking the two off of their sidestands, the FJR seems like a mini-bike in comparo.

While installing heated grips on the FJR yesterday, I noticed an interesting (to me anyway!) tidbit in regard to the handlebar vibration issue. I have an extra set of ST1300 bar ends. When I removed the FJR bar ends, I was surprised by the difference in weight. I put them on my wife's el-cheapo food portion scale and the ST barends weigh rougly FOUR times more than the Yamaha units. Hmmm... with a little modification, I can make the Honda ones work on the FJR. I'll post results at a later date.

BTW, my ST made my right hand go numb nearly all the time, worse so if I had my glove cinched too tight. My first real ride on the FJR was 219 miles. No numbness at all. Go figure...

 

[brianm767]

You have to make your own decision. In the end, you are the one writing the check and having to look in our garage.
Vibration? Yes, there is the 4-cyl. harmonic. Most owners who are sensitive to it use heavier bar-end weights and larger grips (like Hush Puppies foam grips installed over the stockers). It can be ameliorated but not eliminated..IF you are sensitive to it. I have the beginnings of Carpal Tunnel and my right wrist bothers me occaisionally so I use a throttle lock so I can remove my hand and stretch my wrist. I am now on my second FJR because I am able to ease the issue for me.

Edit: If vibrations are that big an issue for you then your decision is made. The ST is rumored to be butter-smooth. Your issue will then become heat management.

Good luck on whatever you buy. I modified every bike I've owned because of "some" issue. Its all about the ride and the smiles.

Yes I am sensitive to vibrations, I owned a Hayabusa and two Blackbirds, it amazing how much the Busa seems to vibrate after riding a Blackbird, if I had never ridden a bird, I would think the busa was smooth, bottom line is I'm trying to keep my Blackbird (wife says no) so I want the one that will be the most confy for two up riding, the heat issue is why I didnt buy either of these bikes up till now, but it's not a perfect world and none of the bikes out there seem perfect to me, I decided I'll just have to do what ever I can to make the heat issue as much of a non issue as I can then just live with it, on cold days it will actually be a plus, I drive 193 miles to work each way five days a week, I never take a bike because it's just too far and too cold, may be the ST will be ok for this? and after all, my Busa vibrates but my XX's will roast your crotch in traffic and I've gotten used to it.

but I havnt picked it up yet and my deposit it refundable, we'll see waht happens.

 

[GreyGoose]

[ I'll just have to do what ever I can to make the heat issue as much of a non issue as I can .

If your looking for the bike that will give you a "tolerable" heat issue, better stay away from St13. I would agree though that [SIZE=14pt]if[/SIZE] both bikes were equal in the heat department, and i was going on a two up, long distance highway only cruise, the st13 "out of the box" would be my pick for the job. Its heavy as hell, really wide, super smooth, and can offer better wind protection (on the stock unit). All the same attributes as a gold wing. Make sure you dont put any of your significant others acessories in the storage compartments in the fairing, They'll melt (i'm not kidding. your cell phone battery will get cooked in there also)......Remember...both bikes are not equal in this department!!!!

GreyGoose

 

[designeraccd]

Heat: my '03 FJR was warm above 70F and started cooking me above 80F. On my '04 ST1300, with the added side deflectors I rode her to Alabama (Barber's..) in lo 90s with humidity to match and while I was very warm it wasn't due to the bike. Those defelectors did keep lotsa engine heat OFF of me. Overall I found the ST to be quite comfy (with a Sargent saddle), good handling, excellent brakes (non ABS), but the sound of her motor drove me nuts! To me she sounded like a tea kettle about to boil over! Yuck. Her gas mileage wasn't as good as the FJR + burned premium. The bike was a typical refined, polished Honda, so good she was almost boring.

OTOH my '06 FJR HAS solved the engine heat problem. Last Summer I rode her in lo 90s with matching humidity and it wasn't too bad: her "air conditioning" worked pretty good above 85! There is some bar vibration in my '06, but the Hush Puppy hand grips plus gel padded gloves do take care of it quite well; some vibes do get thru at certain revz. Never a problem on the STzzzz...schhhaaamooooothhhh. The FJR saddle needs replacing as it starts "burning" in an hour or so. That's not good for a bike like this. On my '03 I put the optional Corbin built saddle and found it to be very comfy for long range riding. If Sargent ever gets a version built for the '06 I'll probably put one on my FJR.

Power on the ST is adequate, but the FJR will easily eat one without trying. The difference is very noticeable.

Both ride and handling are noticeably better on my '06. I fiddeled with all the suspension adjustments on my '03 for @ a month before I got her "acceptable"; haven't touched my '06...gr8 from the factory. Looks: well, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but to this Industrial Designer the ST is one of the most integrated designs out there...as long as the bags are ON. Looks horrid without them.The FJRs are decent looking bikes let down by the way Yamaha applied the colors-the silver breaks my bike in two, graphically. For '07 they have tried to remedy that by taking the silver all the way back to the tail lights-semi-successful. My all silver '03 looked better except for the blACK wheels. Overall I am very pleased to have my second, much improved '06 FJR. Now if the weather would cooperate: currently -1F with some fresh snow. Too cold even for me!

Have fun deciding, both are excellent, but overall my $$$ are on the FJR. DFO

 

[daddysbike]

I'll let you know when I get a '06 or '07 FJR. I believe the time (fixes) is right. I rode my ST1300 10k miles in '04 and Just sold my 2nd 1800 Goldwing, I put over 22k on it and my first. Also have sold a CBR600 and my VFR is up for sale. I would have bought an earlier FJR1300 (I've lusted over it since it came out) but have been staying away until heat/valves fixed. The FJR looks soooooo nice to me and I know its on the sportier side compared to the ST1300 (perfect). The ST was o.k., it is bland, hot and heavy.

Steve

 

[frayne]

I'll let you know when I get a '06 or '07 FJR. I believe the time (fixes) is right. I rode my ST1300 10k miles in '04 and Just sold my 2nd 1800 Goldwing, I put over 22k on it and my first. Also have sold a CBR600 and my VFR is up for sale. I would have bought an earlier FJR1300 (I've lusted over it since it came out) but have been staying away until heat/valves fixed. The FJR looks soooooo nice to me and I know its on the sportier side compared to the ST1300 (perfect). The ST was o.k., it is bland, hot and heavy.
Steve

Have you checked out the Yamaha dealer on 27, I think it is called RT Yamaha or or something like that. They have an 06AE and an 07A sitting on the floor.

Where about you from in N. Georgia ?

 

[EXPDSGT]

Take the outside pin out of the handlebars and you will be able to get the bars more to where they feel right.

 

[Luke]

+1 on removing the pin. Makes that angle "just right"!