Straight Pipes? Yay or Nay.

[Chiefblueman]

Speaking of loud pipes and pissing people off, I live in a gated community...have for 8 years now. I ride a bike to work every day of the week, either my Kaw or my FJR and have done so for 99.9% of every moment I've lived here. Both typically quiet Jap bikes.
There are only two other bike owners in my small community. Both are "Loud Pipes" guys, and they are really, REALLY loud. Obnoxiously so...painfully so...makes you wanna "Kill Them" loud.

Well, back in March, during the annual "Homeowner's Association" meeting, they (the association) decided everyone was fed-up with the two noisy asshats who live within a couple of blocks of me and the association voted to ban motorcycles from the community.

I am NOT an active member of the association. Wouldn't give them a moment of my time if my life depended on it, by the way, but come home one day and my gate code didn't work. Not too big a deal, wait for another vehicle to come to either enter or exit, and drive through the open gate. Next day...same thing happens...wait for an opening and drive through. Third day...same thing. Figured the code panel was effed up so ignored it.

Fourth day, I come through with another vehicle and as I'm getting off my bike, taking my gear off and putting the FJR away in the garage, the president of the association walks her fat ass up the driveway to ask me "what the hell I'm doing?"

Taken aback just a little, and knowing she doesn't know me at all, much less very well, I didn't bother to rip her fucking head off because of the "what the hell I'm doing" comment. I asked her what she meant? She said "what the hell do you think you're doing riding a motorcycle here in the community?" Now I'm starting to get a little pissed and "the Howie in me" starts to come out. I asked her "what the hell is SHE doing asking me what the hell I'M doing?" She replies "Don't you know WE (obviously, the "Royal" we) have banned motorcycles from the community because of the noise?" I told her she and her little pack of fart-sniffers had better get themselves a VERY good lawyer, because right there, without hesitation, I informed her the lawsuit against the "Homeowner's Association" was going to cost them exactly what my house cost me, $365,000, plus another $100,000 for the hell of it.

She blustered and spit and fumed and stomped off.

The next day, there's a letter in my mailbox from the association, outlining the "new" guidelines for residency, which includes the new by-law banning motorcycles.

I take the letter to work with me the following Monday, as we have a lawyer who does a talk show on one of our stations that day. I explain what happened to him, and my response. He proceeds to ask me 3 questions -- "How long have you lived there?" he asks...8 years I tell him. "Was this by-law in the association charter when you purchased your home?" Nope, it's been added only because of 2 of the noisy mutherfuckers riding "Milwaukee Iron"" I tell him. "Was there a cancelled stamp on the envelope in your mailbox" he queries? Nope. "Let me send them a letter before we proceed with this any further" he concludes.

Wednesday, when I get home, MissusHowie asks me why I got a letter from a lawyer, and why doesn't our gate code work any more. I bring her up-to-date and SHE IS PISSED!!!

But the funniest part is yet to come...the lawyer, who I haven't paid a single dime...has responded to the association thusly:

He is threatening to sue the association for $730,000, double the cost of my home...adding in "appreciation", another $500,000 for punitive damages and mental anguish...AND turning the association president and members of the board in the to FBI, Treasury Department, Secret Service and Justice Department for illegal and improper use of the U.S. Mail, for using my mailbox by placing an un-stamped letter in it. I could have laughed my ass off, but I was still pissed at the whole situation.

The next morning, my gate code worked. 2 days later, I received a letter, WITH A STAMP ON IT, stating that I had been "grandfathered-in" under the previous by-laws which didn't include a motorcycle restriction. Additionally, the association would be "happy to" pay the attorney's fee of $1500 to "put an end to this unfortunate misunderstanding" in their words.

I immediately went outside, fired up my FJR, which is quieter than a dead Prius, by the way, and promptly drove around the neighborhood 4 times.

The whole point of this sordid tale? I guess I'm with FJRay who stated

Why label yourself as an ass along with the rest of the loud pipes crowd. We have enough trouble holding on to a decent image with the public as it is. JMHO

Perhaps a better point would be when someone tries fucking with you, don't get mad.....get even, talk to a lawyer first.

Oh, a third point -- making $1500 by writing a letter is a pretty good day's work.

I heard the theme from Rocky when I read this. I've had similar, but not as severe, bullshit delivered by my HOA. You go,Howie, stick it to the man!

From your description, you and I would be good neighbors. We could flip each other off at the mailbox occasionally.

 

[RadioHowie]

From your description, you and I would be good neighbors. We could flip each other off at the mailbox occasionally.

Yep...pretty much condenses my philosophy of life.

 

[exskibum]

Great story, Howie. Back when I was younger and before I was "unemployed", I represented a few HO Assns and had a few cases against HO Assns. Like any other group of people, some people on HOA boards are well intentioned and good servants, while some are just self important asshats with power. It is often a thankless job for no pay and lots of criticism. But too often, HOA boards attract individuals who never before had as much power over others and wield it very poorly, resulting in the worst (sometimes almost laughably amateur) abuses.

Not very far into your story, I was reminded of a letter I wrote on behalf of a friend's 90 year old mother to a similarly officious HO Assn president. Actually, letters like that were only nominally written to the HOA; the real audience for my letter was the HOA's attorney, who I knew would appreciate the well explained bases of liability in the HOA position. From the letter I received in response a week or so later, I knew that a "come to Jesus" meeting had taken place and that my client's problem had disappeared.

But the real point in your story is EXACTLY what I described in post #46, above. Two LOUD asshats probably generated enough complaints that the board took action in the easiest and cheapest way they could, or at least so they thought. They simply tried to ban all motorcycles. That overbroad approach caught you, the innocent, in this. (Forgive me, forumites, for referring to RH as an "innocent".) What they almost certainly already have in the governing instruments that burden all the lots from the get-go is a prohibition against creating a nuisance within the HOA governed properties. Each property owner has that right under most civil laws as well, in addition to enforcing the HOA's prohibition. Point is that if the HOA wants to do something about the obnoxious straight pipe Milwaukee pair, they can proceed on the basis of a nuisance -- measure the noise every morning, document the dBs, and write a letter to the offenders insisting that the nuisance be abated, OR ELSE. The "or else" (for when the neighborly chat inevitably fails) means police involvement leading to a criminal complaint for nuisance, and/or a civil nuisance lawsuit to enjoin the creation of excessive noise on behalf of the HOA. (The "easy way" or "hard way" dynamic in play with the civil suit usually goes down like this: asshat goes to attorney's office with copy of the summons and complaint he received; attorney reads it; attorney says: "you're kidding, right? which do you think is orders of magnitude more expensive -- paying me to try the lawsuit, or you installing mufflers?")

Bounce suggests that lawyers are the root of all evil, and while I disagree less than he might imagine, I've been around long enough to know that the alternative ain't pretty, even if it is more expeditious. I really do see the Texas utility of putting armor piercing rounds in a .300 Win Mag and taking out an HD motor or two. But that'd mean that I'd have to endure the cost and penalties of being charged with a gun crime. Neither that nor the alternative of suffering through the continuing nuisance of unmuffled Milwaukee freedom works for me.

 

[RadioHowie]

VERY well said, my friend.

 

[HotRodZilla]

It's truly sad that 99.9% of attorneys make the rest of them look bad.

Supposedly the good ones ride FJRs.

 

[exskibum]

Zilla -- I mostly represented the little guy and have long said that the biggest part of my job was probably keeping other shysters off my clients' backs and out of their pockets. The legal system is broken. Part of that is that some lawyers will persuade clients to engage in litigation (which is usually the most expensive alternative) when there are better alternatives to be explored, or even when litigation has a poor chance of success for that client. Instead of truly looking out for the client's interests, that lawyer is sometimes looking out for his own bottom line.

Often, the better alternative is to fully explain all the issues and costs to the client and say: "What would it cost for you to put mufflers on the bike? If you'll agree to do that, I'll call the HOA's attorney and see if we can't settle this before anyone spends any real money. I'm pretty sure that I can make a deal in which you'll only be out the cost of the mufflers and maybe an hour or two of my time. Or, if you want me to defend this, I'll need a $10,000 retainer before you leave the office as an installment against the eventual cost of resolving this in court. Oh, and there are no guarantees that you'll win this case, as you know.")

BTW, the most dishonest and unethical attorney I ever faced was on a 'Busa the last time I saw him (summer 2001). I was embarrassed that a prick like that even rode a motorcycle.

 

[Fred W]

It's truly sad that 99.9% of attorneys make the rest of them look bad.
Supposedly the good ones ride FJRs.

One could substitute "LEO" for "Attorney" in the above. JSNS

 

[Auburn]

Since it did make NEPRT...
I am at a loss as to how anyone with enough intelligence to buy an FJR would not know that straight pipes would result in a power loss. Only Harley owners (notice I don't say riders) are ignorant enough to believe that straight pipes increase power on a street motorcycle.

I also have trouble believing that anyone would honestly think that such a ridiculous idea could possibly be well received on this forum. This cannot be for real, he has got to be a troll. I hope he sells that poor FJR (if in fact he does actually own one) and buys another Harley.

Depends on how it is tuned.

There are AMA or world superbike spec motors out there that meet some very quiet noise levels and produce awesome power. MOTOGP for all intents and purposes are straight pipes and loud as hell and getting something like 270 hp out of a 1000 cc motor.

If you leave a motor stock and don't tune it for the increased air flow that the exhaust can handle then you are correct, most times it is a reduction of power that occurs. Just depends on how lean you make the motor. But a bike with a PCV 5 and Auto tune might actually gain power.

 

[JimNtexas]

There are two things (ok, more than two, but these are the top two) things about motorcycle culture that I flat will NEVER understand:

1) The appeal of straight pipes.

2) skulls as decorations

Neither makes the slightest sense to me.

 

[HotRodZilla]

It's truly sad that 99.9% of attorneys make the rest of them look bad.Supposedly the good ones ride FJRs.

One could substitute "LEO" for "Attorney" in the above. JSNS

Haha...I was thinking the same thing...Hell, you could substitute "people named Fred."

FWIW, my personal attorney is expensive and very necessary. She's also worth every goddammed penny.

 

[Auburn]

Great story, Howie. Back when I was younger and before I was "unemployed", I represented a few HO Assns and had a few cases against HO Assns. Like any other group of people, some people on HOA boards are well intentioned and good servants, while some are just self important asshats with power. It is often a thankless job for no pay and lots of criticism. But too often, HOA boards attract individuals who never before had as much power over others and wield it very poorly, resulting in the worst (sometimes almost laughably amateur) abuses.
Not very far into your story, I was reminded of a letter I wrote on behalf of a friend's 90 year old mother to a similarly officious HO Assn president. Actually, letters like that were only nominally written to the HOA; the real audience for my letter was the HOA's attorney, who I knew would appreciate the well explained bases of liability in the HOA position. From the letter I received in response a week or so later, I knew that a "come to Jesus" meeting had taken place and that my client's problem had disappeared.

But the real point in your story is EXACTLY what I described in post #46, above. Two LOUD asshats probably generated enough complaints that the board took action in the easiest and cheapest way they could, or at least so they thought. They simply tried to ban all motorcycles. That overbroad approach caught you, the innocent, in this. (Forgive me, forumites, for referring to RH as an "innocent".) What they almost certainly already have in the governing instruments that burden all the lots from the get-go is a prohibition against creating a nuisance within the HOA governed properties. Each property owner has that right under most civil laws as well, in addition to enforcing the HOA's prohibition. Point is that if the HOA wants to do something about the obnoxious straight pipe Milwaukee pair, they can proceed on the basis of a nuisance -- measure the noise every morning, document the dBs, and write a letter to the offenders insisting that the nuisance be abated, OR ELSE. The "or else" (for when the neighborly chat inevitably fails) means police involvement leading to a criminal complaint for nuisance, and/or a civil nuisance lawsuit to enjoin the creation of excessive noise on behalf of the HOA. (The "easy way" or "hard way" dynamic in play with the civil suit usually goes down like this: asshat goes to attorney's office with copy of the summons and complaint he received; attorney reads it; attorney says: "you're kidding, right? which do you think is orders of magnitude more expensive -- paying me to try the lawsuit, or you installing mufflers?")

Bounce suggests that lawyers are the root of all evil, and while I disagree less than he might imagine, I've been around long enough to know that the alternative ain't pretty, even if it is more expeditious. I really do see the Texas utility of putting armor piercing rounds in a .300 Win Mag and taking out an HD motor or two. But that'd mean that I'd have to endure the cost and penalties of being charged with a gun crime. Neither that nor the alternative of suffering through the continuing nuisance of unmuffled Milwaukee freedom works for me.

exskibum, you speak so many truths about HOA's that I experienced. Altough they serve a purpose, IMHO HOA suck! Unfortunately I lived in a new development for a period of time and was one of the first residents. Somehow I got talked into serving on the board.

Had to deal with a lady that let her dog out everyday to go crap in the lawn in front of the neighbors houses. It was a big mess to get her to follow the rules of the association regarding pets and she signed as a part of her closing papers when she moved in. It went to the point the board was ready to forcebly remove her pet and gave her one final warning. She finally saw the light when her attorney gave her the comin' to jesus talk. I think her attorney finally saw he was not going to get any more money out of her and he was going to lose.

The crazy part was there was a designated place for the residents to let their pets go about 100 feet from her house.

Best day was moving out of there.

Built a house where there are no HOA's. I like the freedom, but I do have to put up with neighbors that may do things I don't always like. I can live with that.

 

[puppychow]

Straight pipes are gay!!

PS - I am sure someone already said this, but I didn't want to dig through 4 pages of replies to find out.

 

[Spud]

Just to blend the two completely off-topic and derailed themes we've got going:

One of my funnest cases as an attorney was when I represented an HOA a few years ago, and forced a Sheriff's deputy to move his boat behind a fence. I've also made people get rid of dogs, move campers, put grass in where there's rock, and re-paint a whole house a different color. Do I feel bad? **** no....

Where I live there are very few neighborhoods controlled by HOA's, and you can buy all the land out in the county to do whatever the hell you want. Go crazy--have 20 dilapidated cars out there if you want... But these assholes move into these few neighborhoods knowing full well, BEFORE THEY BUY or BUILD that they are controlled, then want to cry like little kindergarten kids when told they need to follow the rules they agreed to follow.

In the meantime, they get the higher re-sell value on their property because everyone else that VOLUNTARILY moved in there does follow the rules, and the benefit of a nice tidy neighborhood (if that's what you like).

Since neighbors don't like to be bad neighbors, sometimes it's helpful to have some asshole with no connection to anyone come in and lay down the law. And that asshole around here, is ME.

 

[Fred W]

Really? There are HOAs in Idaho? Who knew?

So, why exactly do people willingly enter into a Homeowner's Ass-ociation? Sure seems like a ridiculously retarded idea to me. Why would you willingly enter into an agreement to allow other asshats to dictate what liberties you have with your own property?

I'll never understand some things.

And yes AJ, Freds are equally represented in the asshat demographics.

 

[wheatonFJR]

Straight pipes are gay!!
PS - I am sure someone already said this, but I didn't want to dig through 4 pages of replies to find out.

Oh, but you do. There MAY be some entertainment value...plus, I'm learning a lot in this thread as well.

 

[wheatonFJR]

In the meantime, they get the higher re-sell value on their property because everyone else that VOLUNTARILY moved in there does follow the rules, and the benefit of a nice tidy neighborhood (if that's what you like).

Really? Cuz, I'm planning on making an out of state move within the next year or so and I will personally make sure that there is no association.

Not after I saw how the HOA Nazis treated my elderly M-in-law. No EFFIN WAY.

 

[HotRodZilla]

BUT did the OP ever go straight pipes or not. I'm dyin' foe him to do it and lay the racket down. COME ON!!

Oh, and don't listen to Puppychow. He's a ruthless deer killer!!

 

[GalaxyBlue]

This thread has many redeeming qualities. One of the few that has captivated me as of late.

 

[exskibum]

exskibum, you speak so many truths about HOA's that I experienced. Altough they serve a purpose, IMHO HOA suck! Unfortunately I lived in a new development for a period of time and was one of the first residents. Somehow I got talked into serving on the board.

Had to deal with a lady that let her dog out everyday to go crap in the lawn in front of the neighbors houses. It was a big mess to get her to follow the rules of the association regarding pets and she signed as a part of her closing papers when she moved in. It went to the point the board was ready to forcebly remove her pet and gave her one final warning. She finally saw the light when her attorney gave her the comin' to jesus talk. I think her attorney finally saw he was not going to get any more money out of her and he was going to lose.

The crazy part was there was a designated place for the residents to let their pets go about 100 feet from her house.

Best day was moving out of there.

Built a house where there are no HOA's. I like the freedom, but I do have to put up with neighbors that may do things I don't always like. I can live with that.

I could tell a couple hours of war stories just from HOA representation. Once upon a time, with my boss and me both on the speaker-phone and on the clock for part of a telephonic conference call board meeting (re: litigation issues), two 70 year old board members called one another out . . . over the phone . . . for all to hear . . . for a fist fight! Bob and I just looked at one another, shook our heads and rolled our eyes in disbelief -- WTF?!?

There are circumstances that make CC&Rs with HOA enforcement a reasonable structure, but I don't and wouldn't personally own a residence subject to that. I like my privacy and the mutual neighborliness of staying out of one another's business.

 

[bwv]

OK so wait... I'm still new here... some clarification please...

Straight pipes or no?

Now that I own an FJR, do I not wave at the Pirates and Beemer snobs? (they didnt wave anywhere near as much when i had my KLR)

And... Does Zilla really hate Howie? (Is it ok to ask that? ...i'm gonna do a "site:fjrforum.com zilla howie hatred" search on it someday...but I'm still new and lazy, and I'm dying to know the back story.)

Kidding... What I really want to know is...

WTF happened to Pluto? Thats TOTAL Bullshit...

Ok.. Kidding again.. Back on topic... (it wont appear so at first... it will look like I'm following all you threadjackers off on your HOA subtopic... but bear with me)

I am in Rural Upstate NY... There is no homeowners association here (the population density is simply too low)

I lived in a trailer (well kept, lawn mowed, no appliances or defunt rotting cars in the yard) on this 4.5 acre property until I could afford to build my family a beautiful home here several years ago. (I even have shrubberies!)

I have always been a very giving neighbor (pulling neighbors well pumps on Xmas, driving drunk ones to go pick up their kids 30 miles away when they needed a ride, mowing lawns and plowing driveways when they couldnt get it done, fixing computers, tv cables, welding stuff... some of you will know what I mean)

Since I have built this home 3 and a half years ago, some changes are happening around me...

The neat, quiet, little old lady next door passed away a couple years ago... I absolutly love my new neigbor family, complete with "17 year old son with a 1 ton turbo diesel pickup with tractor trailer stacks stickin up through the boxt", "19year old gun totin' daughter, who loves wasting ammo when she's not raisin the occasional back yard beef cow", and "22 year old son who loves to run his chainsaw at 7am on sundays". I dig all that shit, I love kids who want to be outside, and completly support them in thier hobbies. BUT... I am beggining to get irritated by the growing pile of shit I have to look at when i decide to have coffee on my front porch... I don't mind the lifestyle..or the noise... hell, I welded the kid up some new brackets for his stacks on his truck cause the old ones shook themselves apart... but I am now looking at two 1 ton dually "parts trucks", 1 1970s industrial case backhoe in 3 peices strewn about, a large green "tent garage", 5 broken late 60's cub cadets, and a pile of brush as tall as big as my garage... which again.. not life altering, but where does the pile end.

The farmer, just slightly down the road, has adopted aged slurry as opposed to traditional manure, which, as some of you may know, tends to leak on the highway more than they get on the fields when transproted...trips home can be very interesting some days.

And... the nieghbor behind me seems to think every weekend is The 4th... or, he owns stock in a fireworks company...

I dont like the idea of an HOA at all... but where is the line when one, or a similar body, becomes a need? But back on topic now...you will see how this all fits the OP topic.

The scruffy alcoholic pirate down the road from me just put straight pipes on his HD.... again.. I like the guy... not a bad guy at all... but the corner by my house seems to require LOTS of additional throttle input on that particular bike when its real late comin home from the bar...

I don't mind the pipes...and I love throttle too...and I'm up late.. but my wife hates it, and sleeps early.. and lightly... she get's real mad.. and I suffer.

The moral of this story...

A.Driod... your F%^&in' straight pipes might just be the straw that breaks the really nice neighbor's sense of community and turns it into a life long fanatical mission to return the niehborhood to its former quiet glory. Keep that in mind.

Or... Were you just trollin' ?