OBFJR
Well-known member
"SAM" I dunno, how about Self Absorbed Moron. Just kidding....give me a break, it's late!
You say supposition........Unless you know the internal manufacturing and sales counts for FJR's each year...it's just speculation. Yes, it's a maturing But, until or unless we have hard numbers....it's all supposition.
I happen to agree with this assessment. what i'm seeing is that very few 'outsiders" crave the sport tourer. The boomers want harley type bikes and arent interested in getting out more than once a month on sunny days. The young crowd wants sport bikes. I know very few converts from those markets to "sport tourers". I've also never met anyone who had a sport tourer that ever went back to anything else. This market will remain at its current state IMHO. There will always be a core of us dyehards, while a few "others" trickle in and trickle out. Why do you think honda isnt very interested in making modifications to the ST (even though it doesent fair well against the competition)? If the sport touring class was a money maker, they'd be all over it. The wing and 600cc classes gets there due dilagence due to demand for the product. Next time you go to a bike meet, take a look around. If you werent paying really really close attention, you wouldnt even know the sport touring market exists.Lets look at this from another perspective that i feel is a good one. What is the total "SAM" of rider that are in the market for a sport-touring bike? Also what are the buying habits of that type of rider? Out of the overall riding community sport-tours make up a very small percentage, so the number of people that are even considering these type of bikes is limited. Also most people that buy ST bikes hold on to them for a while, they do not flip them every year for the next best thing. So the number of units sold will slowly decrease to the extent that the FJR grabs more market share, or the potential buying base increases. There is one major factor that can offset this, which is competition. The ST space is getting very crowded.(THIS IS A GOOD THING) You have bikes like the, ST1300,FJR,k1200gt,new concourse,R1200rt,Sprint st, ECT. ECT. The point being there are many good choices for ST bikes on the market, so it will fragment the overall ST market even more. Yamaha knows this, and that is why they did the PDP. But, with the success of the PDP they may have over estimated what the true demand will be in the market place. Because the bubble of early adaptors have probably already bought their FJR and will not be buying another bike for 3-7 years. So i believe that in 2007 or 2008 we will see many FJR sitting on showroom floor, with heavy discounts, not because it is a bad bike, but because of the over saturation of the ST market. So in conclusion is the FJR market drying up? Maybe, 2007 will be a year where we can really see if that is true.
This is a repost but i'm a little interested to see what people think about this. True, False or just indifferent
This is so true. Sport touring is an activity. The bikes that call themselves Sport Tourers are often not used that way, and bikes that wouldn't come close to the "normal" definition of sport tourer are often racking up more miles than most riders of any bike would dream of. That said, I feel that the Sport Touring market is nowhere near maxed out.Well, there are those who believe that sport-touring is more an activity that a style of motorcycle.[/u]
Yamaha, Honda ect will continue to sell bikes as long as it's profitable... What else is there to say?
Josh
I my opinion, the sport touring market is just getting its legs. Comfort, performance and utilitarian values are what consumers are eagar for. Just like in the early 90's when SUV's became all the rage, it was all about having one vehicle that can do everything.So in conclusion is the FJR market drying up?
Ahhh, the old Loss Leader trick... Home Depot uses this all of the time: They advertise or merchandise stuff at or below cost, cuz they know you're thinking, "Gee, while I'm here, I mi'aswell, pick up that paint for the living room and while the old lady's on the rag, I mi'aswell get that new lawn mower..."From a business sense why would you sell something you loose money on. Maybe for a very short period of time but over the long haul your out of business.
You can't spend more than you bring in. wish the gov't would learn that little lesson. OOPS not to be political of course.
Glenn
+1 on the activity instead of the bike style.... I rode my 97 Honda Valkyrie 'Tourer' as a Sport Touring bike more often than not...I used to go thru footpegs once a year from grindin em down so much.... :blink: ... I think ST is more mental than bike build... (IMHO)This is so true. Sport touring is an activity. The bikes that call themselves Sport Tourers are often not used that way, and bikes that wouldn't come close to the "normal" definition of sport tourer are often racking up more miles than most riders of any bike would dream of. That said, I feel that the Sport Touring market is nowhere near maxed out.Well, there are those who believe that sport-touring is more an activity that a style of motorcycle.[/u]
1) Motorcycling popularity is still growing
2) Gas prices are driving people into looking at bikes as a primary vehicle (more often than before)
3) Sport touring bikes are clearly the best available motorcycles to satisfy what many people look for: comfort, performance, touring
Lastly, the EU market for them is much larger than here so the sport touring models are sustainable (they will make them for the EU market and they might as well make the extra money of selling them here if they have them)
That's my story, and I might not stick to it
+1 on the activity instead of the bike style.... I rode my 97 Honda Valkyrie 'Tourer' as a Sport Touring bike more often than not...I used to go thru footpegs once a year from grindin em down so much.... :blink: ... I think ST is more mental than bike build... (IMHO)Mosa
Paraphrasing a Supreme Court Justice on the topic of pornography, "I may not be able to define Sport Touring, but I know it when I see it." When I strapped a duffel bag on my CB160 in 1966 and went sailing through WV down to Ocracoke with a CB450 and a Yamaha 350 2-stroke, we were sport touring. A Gold Wing AIN'T a sport tourer!!! HD doesn't make sport tourers, but a few of those guys really do sport touring. Although Beemer and Guzzi drivers can make a pretty good claim to the contrary, IMO the first real ground up sport tourer was the Kawasaki Concours, but it really isn't the bike as much as the mind set of the driver. If there wasn't a growing market why did Kawasaki make the Connie 14 after twenty years of consistent sales of the old Connie. That's twenty years of income with all retool investment paid up long time ago. Why did Honda make the ST1100 and then the ST1300? If Sport Touring is a declining market why is the new Triumph ST's and Tiger selling so well. Anyone care to put up some pesos to bet against 95%+ sales of 2007 FJR1300A's in the US this year????what i'm seeing is that very few 'outsiders" crave the sport tourer. The boomers want harley type bikes and arent interested in getting out more than once a month on sunny days. The young crowd wants sport bikes. I know very few converts from those markets to "sport tourers". I've also never met anyone who had a sport tourer that ever went back to anything else. This market will remain at its current state IMHO. There will always be a core of us dyehards, while a few "others" trickle in and trickle out. Why do you think honda isnt very interested in making modifications to the ST (even though it doesent fair well against the competition)? If the sport touring class was a money maker, they'd be all over it. The wing and 600cc classes gets there due dilagence due to demand for the product. Next time you go to a bike meet, take a look around. If you werent paying really really close attention, you wouldnt even know the sport touring market exists.
Paraphrasing a Supreme Court Justice on the topic of pornography, "I may not be able to define Sport Touring, but I know it when I see it." When I strapped a duffel bag on my CB160 in 1966 and went sailing through WV down to Ocracoke with a CB450 and a Yamaha 350 2-stroke, we were sport touring. A Gold Wing AIN'T a sport tourer!!! HD doesn't make sport tourers, but a few of those guys really do sport touring. Although Beemer and Guzzi drivers can make a pretty good claim to the contrary, IMO the first real ground up sport tourer was the Kawasaki Concours, but it really isn't the bike as much as the mind set of the driver. If there wasn't a growing market why did Kawasaki make the Connie 14 after twenty years of consistent sales of the old Connie. That's twenty years of income with all retool investment paid up long time ago. Why did Honda make the ST1100 and then the ST1300? If Sport Touring is a declining market why is the new Triumph ST's and Tiger selling so well. Anyone care to put up some pesos to bet against 95%+ sales of 2007 FJR1300A's in the US this year????what i'm seeing is that very few 'outsiders" crave the sport tourer. The boomers want harley type bikes and arent interested in getting out more than once a month on sunny days. The young crowd wants sport bikes. I know very few converts from those markets to "sport tourers". I've also never met anyone who had a sport tourer that ever went back to anything else. This market will remain at its current state IMHO. There will always be a core of us dyehards, while a few "others" trickle in and trickle out. Why do you think honda isnt very interested in making modifications to the ST (even though it doesent fair well against the competition)? If the sport touring class was a money maker, they'd be all over it. The wing and 600cc classes gets there due dilagence due to demand for the product. Next time you go to a bike meet, take a look around. If you werent paying really really close attention, you wouldnt even know the sport touring market exists.
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