Heated Liner

[TomInPA]

The idea of using a battery pack on a motorcycle has real limitations. Heated clothing uses a lot of power and battery packs are capable of generating only a fraction of that power requirement and for very limited periods of time. For example, Warm n Safe is pretty blunt about it. They have developed a battery pack that is capable of powering the 90 watt Heated Liner powered with the 7.4 volt battery will produce 30 watts of heat when turned on full power, but for only one-hour at a time before recharging. It is a simple function that heat generation and time of use are limited by physical constraints like the size and weight of battery packs. I will be very surprised if battery powered clothing is satisfactory for anything but short periods of time providing minimal supplemental heat.

10 hours? the Ansai li-ion battery is 7.42V 2.2ah That means for 10-hours you can produce at-most 0.22 amps at 7.42 volts. That yields only 1.63 watts of heat, or more like 16.4 watts of heat for one-hour. That is about 1/2 of the heat output calculated by WNS here. based on a 7.4 VDC 5.2 ah battery. It's a great idea, but the claims of heating clothing for 10-hours are unrealistic, and even if theoretically possible to meter heat from such a limited battery over that period of time, would not generate perceptible heat.

 

[Drew]

The idea of using a battery pack on a motorcycle has real limitations.

It is a simple function that heat generation and time of use are limited by physical constraints like the size and weight of battery packs.

... surprised if battery powered clothing is satisfactory for anything but short periods of time providing minimal supplemental heat.

... the claims of heating clothing for 10-hours are unrealistic .... would not generate perceptible heat.

What a freakin' buzzkill!

 

[SkooterG]

I have an old Warm-n-safe that I like. Much better than the old Widder vest I have.

MCN did a review of heated gear a little over a year ago. I was not able to find it online, but I did find the raw data and article of the author: Clicky.

And a follow-up article in MCN (written by the same guy) on Warm-N-Safe's new wireless remote controller that is the dog's danglies: Clicky again.

Reader's digest: Get the Warm-N-Safe liner and their wireless controller. For gloves you might want to consider the Gerbings if not going with Warm-N-Safe.

 

[Spud]

The idea of using a battery pack on a motorcycle has real limitations.

It is a simple function that heat generation and time of use are limited by physical constraints like the size and weight of battery packs.

... surprised if battery powered clothing is satisfactory for anything but short periods of time providing minimal supplemental heat.

... the claims of heating clothing for 10-hours are unrealistic .... would not generate perceptible heat.

What a freakin' buzzkill!

I don't have any illusions that the $100 Ansai will heat for 10 hours--I got it for my thermally challenged wife to use for cold fall/winter/spring evening walks. But I do think the technology is coming. Here's a review where they tried the new Columbia jacket, stating: "In most cases, the coat managed to keep our core suitably warm even in bitterly cold conditions, and for 5.5 solid hours to boot."

https://www.engadget.com/2011/03/04/columbia-omni-heat-circuit-breaker-softshell-electric-heated-j/

That jacket uses "two rechargeable battery packs." With smart phones, hybrids, etc. battery technology is THE big thing right now, and I think within a few years a relatively compact battery will provide many hours of heat in electric jackets and vest...

 

[Drew]

MCN did a review of heated gear a little over a year ago.

Skooter,

This may be the article, thanks for the heads up. Clicky.

 

[SkooterG]

MCN did a review of heated gear a little over a year ago.

Skooter,

This may be the article, thanks for the heads up. Clicky.

That was it!

 

[Good2Go]

on Warm-N-Safe's new wireless remote controller that is the dog's danglies:

Reader's digest: Get the Warm-N-Safe liner and their wireless controller.

+1...I've been using the dual wireless controller for my gloves and liner for a couple of years. Bought a wired controller to carry for backup...and it's still sealed in the original package.

 

[TomInPA]

The idea of using a battery pack on a motorcycle has real limitations.

It is a simple function that heat generation and time of use are limited by physical constraints like the size and weight of battery packs.

... surprised if battery powered clothing is satisfactory for anything but short periods of time providing minimal supplemental heat.

... the claims of heating clothing for 10-hours are unrealistic .... would not generate perceptible heat.

What a freakin' buzzkill!

I don't have any illusions that the $100 Ansai will heat for 10 hours--I got it for my thermally challenged wife to use for cold fall/winter/spring evening walks. But I do think the technology is coming. Here's a review where they tried the new Columbia jacket, stating: "In most cases, the coat managed to keep our core suitably warm even in bitterly cold conditions, and for 5.5 solid hours to boot."

https://www.engadget....ctric-heated-j/

That jacket uses "two rechargeable battery packs." With smart phones, hybrids, etc. battery technology is THE big thing right now, and I think within a few years a relatively compact battery will provide many hours of heat in electric jackets and vest...

I think a jacket that has very good insulation and wind-breaking properties and is not subjected to the extreme wind of a motorcycle can be expected to retain heat pretty well. I can't judge the Columbia heated gear since the electrical specs were not available. I do know that for skiing, a small amount of warmth in the feet or hands can go a long way to increasing comfort. I rarely find my "core" to be where I lose heat in winter skiing or hiking, but definitely when sitting at an outdoor bar or restaurant, core heat can be lost quickly.

The approach with MC heated gear is to wear it very close to the body over one thin layer, then insulate on top of that. The equipment produces 60 to 90 watts of warming power because that is what is needed at times, but I know we operate at 15-30 watts when conditions don't require a lot of heat input. Battery units running on about 7.5 volts can achieve 16 to 30 watts, but they can't last long at that rate based on battery limits. Maybe you can stay warm with 2-10 watts of heat. I'd guess that it is just enough to take off the chill, if the jacket is well insulated, and not subjected to wind. There are members much better at electrical stuff than I am, and I'd like to hear their opinions, but the constraint of 7.42V 2.2ah is pretty severe. I think the claim is made based on theoretical heat loss using very well insulated clothing, and your real-world results may vary, particularly on a motorcycle.

 

[guyver60]

+1 on the Warm-n-Safe. I've been very happy with the liner and gloves. I had an issue with my first liner after about a year, but the turn around on the repair was one week. Last year I upgraded to their Gen 4 with the remote dual controller. I believe the First Gear heated clothing is made by Warm-n-Safe. Whatever you decide on, you might want to order before it gets cold weather and everyone else decides they want heated gear. I went to order my first gear in November several years ago and several sizes and items were back ordered - especially with the Gerbings brand.

 

[FJR-RemingtonRider]

I have the Tourmaster Synergy vest.

Rode 3k round trip in 14 degree weather, no failures and never had it turned up full blast.

Used it daily during the winter. Just don't forget to plug it in when you get off/on bike.

Set up was:

Under Armour Long sleeve cold gear,

Tourmaster Vest,

Fieldsheer Leather Jacket w/liner.

 

[Harald]

I bought the Aerostich heated liner with my Darien suit 4 years ago. After 25 years of riding in all kinds of weather, I'd never used heated gear but decided to give it a try. Wow! It sure makes winter commuting when it's 35 degrees and raining soo much nicer! :yahoo: And even down to my record low ride of 17 degrees, the liner makes it doable. But the bad news is that the liner failed shortly after I got it and was replaced under warranty. Then a couple years later it failed again and I had to jumps through a lot of hoops and make a big stink to get it replaced because they don't have a lifetime warranty on their liners. I should add that I'm very cautious with the liner and never even ball it up to store it, so I can't explain why I had so many failures.

If I was buying one today, I'd probably get the Gerbing liner with microwire technology (as opposed to Aerostich's "big wire" technology) for more even heating and because of the lifetime warranty.

As far as battery power goes, I have a set of Harley Davidson brand, waterproof, leather, battery powered heated gloves that are made by Gerbing. On max power the batteries only last about 45 minutes, but that is long enought to get me to work where I can recharge. I only need max power when it's below freezing. At the more usual 50% power setting, the batteries last 2.5 hours. And on low they go 4 hours. Clearly these won't work for LD riding, but they're great for a commuter or afternoon rider.

 

[Burnspot]

Thanks for the info in this thread! I'm weighing my options at the moment for a heated liner and eventually some gloves (got heated grips, so gloves are down the list). I'm probably opting for the Warm n Safe liner with the dual remote option. That sounds like the way to go.

 

[2006FJR]

Warm N Safe designed and made the Gerbings and First Gear jacket liners. Gerbings went and copied and outsourced components for fabrication in China. I don't know the details, but thought it was bad form.. If you go to the Warm N Safe site, you ca register as an ADVforum member and get a significant discount. The discount shows up on the prices as soon as you register. It is the best equipment out there. I strongly recommend the Generation 4 jacket liner (90 watt) and remote troller.

I have Olympia Airglide mesh and use the liner with no problem. For very cold weather, it is actually best to wear the heated liner over a long-sleeve T-shirt or other tight clothing, with your Olympia wind/insulation layer over the top of the liner, then finish with the mesh jacket. That will stand up to pretty much anything.

EDIT: I was contacted by another forum member that my information on Gerbings was dated. I researched it briefly, and I believe that I need to reconsider my comment. Gerbings is bringing manufacturing back to the U.S.based on this article.

This is what Mike Coen said on his Warm n Safe site:

Over the years while we tried to make the Heat-troller™ better, we also helped Gerbing make their product better. We turned them on to our designed SAE connector and cables and when we spent 3 years and lots of money developing the coax connector, we let them use it. Then they copied it. The little pocket in the sleeve for the glove plug, we showed them how to do it. Even the resistance wire they use we helped them by designing a better wire so it would not break as often at the solder points and we advised them to go to a higher temperature fire point on the wire. We advised them to cover the auto style fuse in their battery harness after we blew a fuse using their battery harness. We made ours with a cover so it would not happen. So after all the years of helping them make a better product, we were surprised to see them sell a copy of one of our old designs that they are buying from China. We are also marketing products not just for the motorcycle area but for people in wheelchairs, heavy equipment operators and office workers. We are open to ideas. You need heated gear for your particular situation, let us know and we will try to help you.
Well, this was suppose to be a company history but I am not sure what that really means and why you need to care. The important issues are these. We will continue to make improvements in our products and hope that the Chinese don't copy them. We hope you will help us deal with the Chinese copiers by not buying their products whether it is a copy of ours or anyone else's. We will stand behind our product by making sure that if it is a manufacturing defect you will get a replacement and if it is a use or abuse or just age that kills it, you will get a discount on a new one to show you that we care that you bought from us in the first place. And if we don't stop the Chinese from copying US made products, none of us will have a future!

Mike is a good guy and will stand behind his products. We have Rev 4 of their heated gear and it works perfectly.

 

[VanHarlan]

Just Ordered my Gen4 Warm & Safe Jacket Liner and the Dual Remote Heat Troller . . . it's been on my "Farkle Priority List" for a couple years now and I finally made it down to that part of the list . . . next year I'll add the pants, socks, and perhaps gloves.

After reading as much as I could find I settled on the Warm & Safe gear for a variety of reasons . . . very favorable reviews . . . design . . . USA made . . . available options not only for liners (and tall sizes), but also controllers and wiring accessories (I have two bikes and want to be able to easily share the system between them).

 

[kevins]

I don't have any heated clothing, but a friend of mine has had several years of good results with this Aerostich vest, electric heat and air inflatable to insure full contact against your body, and the air chamber itself does provide an insulating layer.

https://www.aerostich.com/aerostich-kanetsu-tltec-wind-blocker-electric-vest.html (both vest w/sleeve option, and complete liner shown at this page)

Other vests of theirs-

https://www.aerostich.com/aerostich-kanetsu-tltec-wind-blocker-electric-vest.html (another option shown at the bottom of this page)

About 6 years ago, I rode to Aerostich, bought their jacket, liner and electric vest. I don't want to say anything bad but I returned the electric vest and liner and gave away (yes for free) the jacket. I didn't know if the heated liner was on or off on a cold day. I bought an Eclipse heated liner (they made them for a couple of years with the new ownership and discontinued production). For me, the Aerostitch is nowhere the fit and feel of other jackets/ gear I have or had. Just my $.02

 

[Niehart]

Just saw this sale on heated gear.

https://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/1/1/461/CDEPT/Street-Bike-Heated-Gear-Mens-Riding-Gear-Closeouts.aspx

 

[kegg]

What a timely thread. I've been thinking about some heated gear to extend the riding season to all year.

 

[Fred W]

What a timely thread. I've been thinking about some heated gear to extend the riding season to all year.

Yeah. Me too. But I'll either need to get a studded snow tire on the Feej or a plane ticket.

 

[VanHarlan]

received my Warm & Safe Gen4 Jacket Liner and Dual Remote Troller . . . very impressed with the quality, ease & flexibility of install, and how awesome the Remote Control works. Ordered the Gen4 pants and Socks right away as well as a second wiring harness for our other bike. Very well thought out gear and functionality . . . +1 for Warm & Safe in my book.

 

[Tanker]

Received my Warm & Safe liner and ultimate gloves about a month ago. Had a cold and rainy ride home from the U.P. in Michigan a few weeks back and I was quite comfortable for the entire trip.

I didn't know what I was missing, even though many of my riding companions have been telling me for years to get some. Very nice!!