Shorai battery

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Thank you for your efforts and proofing out this product.

The data point is what we all want to make informed choices.

I wanted to own one of these very badly but your data and blow by blow shows me my blood pressure is not up to the task of just starting my bike.

It is a big step forward and in a few years I think it will be ready for prime time. Maybe by that time I can come up with a good reason to let go of my 10 for a 13 or 14?

 
Thanks for all the work Gary but, too much drama for me. Marginal starting under 40F is just not an option when we've ridden and planned trips with the mornings hovering around 30.
What's your auxiliary heat with the heat pump? I've noticed many are installing dual fuel systems which have a gas furnace for auxiliary heat. I believe they switch over to gas heat when the outside temp drops below 35 degrees or so.
My auxillary is electric coils. It's working fine, kept us at 73 all night. However, the heat pump doesn't do too well below 45 or so. But most nights are above that here in Fla.
So we don't get toooo far off topic...my heat pump (Trane XL15i) goes to aux heat (propane) at 30F. Down to that temperature it works well and keeps the house comfortable w/o working too hard. When it was originally installed, it was set to change over at 25F but at that temperature, was struggling to keep the house warm.

FWIW, Mitsubishi makes heat pumps that work well down into the single digits.

--G
Thanks for the feedback, G. We got the "York" on sale a couple years ago. Thank the Lord for the 10 year warranty. They've replaced practically the whole unit, indoors and out, in several service calls over the past 3 1/2 years since we got it. Hunk-a-junk. It's the Harley of air conditioners. However, now that it's working, it does save us a pretty good penny on electric bills. I'm not sure at what temp the heating coils kick on. Just guessing here. Next time around, who knows when, I'm thinking about a Trane or Carrier.

Gary

 
Temps in the 20's this week in the morning. Garage is typically 5-8 degrees warmer. Tuesday and Wednesday it took 5 and 6 cranks, respectively, to fire it up. Thursday and Friday I had it connected to the tender overnight. Fired on the first crank each day.

I've found that when I turn on the Motolites, the voltage sentry immediately goes from green to yellow. Returns to green immediately when I turn them off. I had a bulb lookoing shady and replaced the pair. No change. I didn't think thye had that big a draw.

 
Temps in the 20's this week in the morning. Garage is typically 5-8 degrees warmer. Tuesday and Wednesday it took 5 and 6 cranks, respectively, to fire it up. Thursday and Friday I had it connected to the tender overnight. Fired on the first crank each day.
I've found that when I turn on the Motolites, the voltage sentry immediately goes from green to yellow. Returns to green immediately when I turn them off. I had a bulb lookoing shady and replaced the pair. No change. I didn't think thye had that big a draw.
Well if yo upgraded to the 55 watt you have a very nice draw. I went to the LEDs for that reason.

 
I would think that you could hang a 'drop-light' near the battery and keep it warm (this could help for early morning starts hoping that if you needed to start again, later in the day, it would be warmer outside). This would at least help save the starter (with all the repeated cranking that seems to be required). Note: this to (maybe) help the guys that have already gotten the Shorai; personally I wouldn't buy the lithium battery knowing what the early adapters have had to go through. Cold weather performance has been documented, pretty much across the board; i.e. hybrid cars, and other applications.

 
Temps in the 20's this week in the morning. Garage is typically 5-8 degrees warmer. Tuesday and Wednesday it took 5 and 6 cranks, respectively, to fire it up. Thursday and Friday I had it connected to the tender overnight. Fired on the first crank each day.
I've found that when I turn on the Motolites, the voltage sentry immediately goes from green to yellow. Returns to green immediately when I turn them off. I had a bulb lookoing shady and replaced the pair. No change. I didn't think thye had that big a draw.
Not sure which model of Shorai you've got. We assume you're running the 18AH model? Another important question: when did you buy it? It seems that Shorai upgraded their batteries in mid Dec of 2012. Not sure if they carry the same model numbers. Perhaps you could contact them if there's a question. We don't want to compare apples to oranges here.

Gary

darksider #44

PS. It appears that our cold weather is done for this year in my neck of the woods.

 
Yes, I'm running the 18AH model. I bought the original battery from batterystuff.com. At the DC bike show in Jan. 2012, I talked to the Shorai guy about the poor cold weather performance. He told me to send him an email for a replacement with an upgraded version at no cost. So I received the upgraded chemistry battery in about March or so of last year.

Maybe they'll send me another upgrade.
yeaahh.gif


 
Hi All, I am still a little confused about the new battery technology. I want to buy a battery soon before the season starts. Simply put: Shorai or not?

Thanks

 
...Simply put: Shorai or not?
Thanks
Living in NY -- not.

You are welcome
smile.png


Look at any of the name brand (VLRA) AGM lead acid batteries. Batteries are more alike than different, a recommendation of one over another is mostly opinion and not fact. One persons favorite battery can be another persons most hated product. Leave this thread and go back to the main Forum page then type battery in the search box. Plan to spend a couple of weeks reading and still not know much more about the 'best battery' you can buy.

 
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Flyer : It seems that you have an older version of this battery like I do.

Lou D : per your question above: my research deals with what now appears to be last year's version of this battery. It seems there's a new, better one available now. I'm afraid I'm not much help here, but based on WHERE you live, I'd be extra careful with your decision if I were you.

 
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I just ordered one as a replacement for my agm that suffered a failed cell, puts out a nice 10.5 VDC now. But reading through this thread it sounds like I may be in for some cold weather starting issues unless the latest flavor has it fixed. Anyone know if there is a serial number cutoff for the old/new versions? Or do I need to request that a cold weather model be shipped?

 
I just ordered one as a replacement for my agm that suffered a failed cell, puts out a nice 10.5 VDC now. But reading through this thread it sounds like I may be in for some cold weather starting issues unless the latest flavor has it fixed. Anyone know if there is a serial number cutoff for the old/new versions? Or do I need to request that a cold weather model be shipped?
I would not trust a new and improve battery when this thread proves Shorai batteries have cold start issues. Why risk it? I would stop the order, refuse delivery and or return that sucker faster than the Road Runner near a pack of Wille E Coyotes.

I still have the stock battery in my 2009, works great no trouble.

Would I like a smaller battery? You bet. Then I could install a fuse box up there but it any battery must be reliable as my existing battery.

 
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Temps in the 20's this week in the morning. Garage is typically 5-8 degrees warmer. Tuesday and Wednesday it took 5 and 6 cranks, respectively, to fire it up. Thursday and Friday I had it connected to the tender overnight. Fired on the first crank each day.
I've found that when I turn on the Motolites, the voltage sentry immediately goes from green to yellow. Returns to green immediately when I turn them off. I had a bulb lookoing shady and replaced the pair. No change. I didn't think thye had that big a draw.
Not sure which model of Shorai you've got. We assume you're running the 18AH model? Another important question: when did you buy it? It seems that Shorai upgraded their batteries in mid Dec of 2012. Not sure if they carry the same model numbers. Perhaps you could contact them if there's a question. We don't want to compare apples to oranges here.

Gary

darksider #44

PS. It appears that our cold weather is done for this year in my neck of the woods.
That was then and this is now.

Announcing Shorai 2014: here we go again.

Now, before you start groaning, remember when I first started this thread that I said that this would be an ongoing project. I copied the post above as sort of a launchpad for this latest experiment. To explain what I'm doing, you'll recall that we've already learned that Shorai updates and improves their product every so often. I no sooner completed my testing of the battery I bought in December 2012... that I found out it was already outdated. All that testing for what, I asked myself. Anyway, back in October at the International Motorcycle Expo in Orlando, I talked at length to a Shorai rep at the show. When I explained to him my dilemma, I told him that I did all this testing for the forum, and we determined that essentially the battery failed our cold weather testing, but now the battery is obsolete, as well as all the testing I did. He waited patiently while I moaned and groaned. I told him of all the guys who read this thread, and how many were sitting on the fence waiting for SOMEBODY to create a Lithium battery that would work in colder weather. He wanted to know exactly at what temperature the Shorai failed to start my FJR. I was trying to remember, but alas, couldn't be sure.

Then he shocked me. He gave me a phone number to call and told me to ask for Shawn. "Tell him you spoke to me," he said. When it was all said and done, a brand new Shorai 18AH was on its way to my house. I promised to test it and post up the results, and also to forward the link back to him. He was genuinely interested in how my test(s) went.

I installed the Shorai, which was the latest generation from the late fall of 2013, into my FJR in November. I sent my old Shorai back to them for testing. The old Shorai was working pretty well for me as long as the temps were above 42 or so. However this week was the first time that the temps here in Fla dipped into the 30's so I could test the new one.

Gary

darksider #44

 
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On Monday night, I covered up the plants and parked the FJR outside in the driveway. Tuesday morning, coldest yet this winter here in Florida, I was up early and went out to try starting the bike.

Temp: 36 degrees

Voltage: 13.2 before turning on key, dropped to 12.8 after turning on key.

Starting procedure: Turned key. Voltage dropped to mid 10's. Engine cranked over slow but steadily. Started in about 2 1/2 seconds on the first try. I'm pretty amazed. There was no way last year's Shorai could have done this at 36 degrees. I tested it a number of times and it just wasn't able. The Shorai has indeed been improved, just like the Shorai rep promised. The new battery is a whole different animal. Very happy to see this kind of result. I remember last year it took me 5 tries to start the bike one morning when it was 34 degrees. It's supposed to get a little colder Tuesday night. Stay tuned.

Gary

darksider #44

 
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On Tuesday night, I left the bike outside again. Next morning, after getting ready for work, I stepped outside to feel the air. Sure enough, it felt even colder than Monday. I walked up to the bike and I was right, it was 34 degrees on the thermometer. This is the same thermometer that I used last year, by the way.

You might recall that I attempted to start it at 34 degrees one morning, and it took me 5 tries. Copied below is that attempt from a year ago.


Posted 28 December 2012 - 09:18 AM


Finally got some decent (is there such a thing?) cold weather. It was 34 bone chilling degrees outside.

Check voltmeter: 13.2
Turn on heated grips to medium setting: voltage slowly dropped to 12.7 or so. 3 minutes later I hit the start button for 6 seconds. Cranked slowly at first, then got slower still. Voltage dropped to the 8's. No start. Clock reset to 1:00. Cranking duration: about 6 seconds

Second attempt: Left the key (and parking lights) on, waited one minute, tried again: voltage just before turning the key, 12.5 Same results as above, no apparent difference in cranking speed (that I could tell). Cranking duration: about 6 seconds.
Third attempt: Left the key on again, waited one minute, voltage just before hitting starter button: 12.6 Same results as above with the exception that engine cranked slightly faster initially, but slowed to a very slow steady crank. Cranking duration: about 6 seconds
Fourth attempt: Left the key on again, waited one minute, voltage just before hitting starter button, 12.8 Same results as above with the exception that engine cranked quite a bit faster (initially), almost fast enough to start (I'm getting good at telling by ear what cranking speed is necessary to light her off, it's pretty consistent). Clock didn't reset this time, but starter slowed to a slow steady crank... faster than earlier attempts. Cranking duration: about 4 seconds
Fifth attempt: Left the key on again, waited one minute, voltage just before hitting starter button, 12.9 Wow what a difference. The last attempt was noticeably faster, and this one was faster still. I could hear as soon as I hit the button that we were within the range where it normally starts. And of course, it did.
Total duration of all this: about 7 or 8 minutes.

What I learned today: the engine definitely cranks faster each time I make the attempt. Today I noted that the battery's voltage after waiting one minute in between starting attempts was rising slowly.


Tuesday, 1/7/14

Temp: 34 degrees

Voltage: 13.2 before turning key, 12.7 after.

Starting procedure: Turned key, engine cranked slowly for perhaps 3 1/2 seconds, and engine started. Based on the cranking speed, I'm guessing that I'm pretty close to the lowest possible temperature that the bike can start on the first try. It was definitely cranking slower than Monday when the temp was 36. Amazing that I can hear and tell the difference with just a 2 degree change. Oh well. Compare this to the regimen I had to go through last year at the same temp. (Shown above).

What I learned: This new Shorai is indeed a better battery than the one I tested a year ago. Just as we surmised at the onset of all of this over a year ago, technology is marching on. I will attempt to test the battery further if and when the temps drop to freezing or below. Stay tuned.

Gary

darksider #44

 
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I'd love to send the paperweight I have in my garage closet back to them. My 2012 battery discharged while I was in PA from November to April 2013. When I flew back to ride the bike from CA to PA the Shorai battery wouldn't hold a charge. Ironically, I pulled the old AGM battery off the shelf where I put it when I installed the Shorai, and it worked fine, and continues to fire the bike. I still have the Shorai in the original box, and just never bothered to complain.

 
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