Spank Daily News

[painman]

This is sad news. I remember Uncle Bud from WFO5. It was just in passing, and I'm sorry I didn't take the time to meet him. In times like this it is important we hold eachother up, especially his family. This does make us examine our own lives and whats going on with us and how uncertain life is, so I am holding the family and friends of Uncle Bud up in prayer today...hopefully we will meet someday, until then..... PM. <><

 

[madmike2]

'Tis a sad commentary on the passion we share and the "sport" of Iron Butt riding. From the comments of those who knew and rode with him and the pieces shared about his wife's outlook, I think I'm less a person for not knowing "Uncle Bud". RIP, sir.

What happened to SkooterG. He had a tremendous total of points and then he had "zero"...to end up with 93K. I am opining here, since I am not a member and have never ridden in a rally....but if he did something "horrendous" (A major infraction of the rules) he should have be asked to quit (meaning: tossed out on his derriere ), no? And if there was a minor infraction, should he have lost the points he was going for? It looks like he lost upwards of 100K + points on the 2nd day. It seems the man was well on his way to winning another rally this year, then "poof": nada, zilch, zero, nyet, nuthin'. Can someone who knows the rules the IBA guys play by fill in the gaps? One would assume there is some discretion used and the standard is the same for everyone riding the rally. Are the "penalties" proscribed in such a manner that everyone knows? Is there some sort of umpire or referee to conference with? Is it the sole discretion of one person? Are penalties meted out in an arbitrary or ambiguous way? The silence is deafening.

I'm prolly stirring up the mud puddle but honestly, as an innocent bystander who is curious. I'd really like to know before I consider taking the path to "the dark side".

Edit: Is there some unwritten code or rule that says one "Thou shalt not ask stupid or probing questions?" If there is, I guess its too late for me.

 

[Rogue]

'Tis a sad commentary on the passion we share and the "sport" of Iron Butt riding. From the comments of those who knew and rode with him and the pieces shared about his wife's outlook, I think I'm less a person for not knowing "Uncle Bud". RIP, sir.
What happened to SkooterG. He had a tremendous total of points and then he had "zero"...to end up with 93K. I am opining here, since I am not a member and have never ridden in a rally....but if he did something "horrendous" (A major infraction of the rules) he should have be asked to quit (meaning: tossed out on his derriere ), no? And if there was a minor infraction, should he have lost the points he was going for? It looks like he lost upwards of 100K + points on the 2nd day. It seems the man was well on his way to winning another rally this year, then "poof": nada, zilch, zero, nyet, nuthin'. Can someone who knows the rules the IBA guys play by fill in the gaps? One would assume there is some discretion used and the standard is the same for everyone riding the rally. Are the "penalties" proscribed in such a manner that everyone knows? Is there some sort of umpire or referee to conference with? Is it the sole discretion of one person? Are penalties meted out in an arbitrary or ambiguous way? The silence is deafening.

I'm prolly stirring up the mud puddle but honestly, as an innocent bystander who is curious. I'd really like to know before I consider taking the path to "the dark side".

Edit: Is there some unwritten code or rule that says one "Thou shalt not ask stupid or probing questions?" If there is, I guess its too late for me.

Well the rally rules are whatever "The Rally *******" says they are! We won't know untill Skooter or someone else who know says but my bet is he made an administrative error that invalidated his points on that leg.

 

[madmike2]

Well the rally rules are whatever "The Rally *******" says they are! We won't know untill Skooter or someone else who know says but my bet is he made an administrative error that invalidated his points on that leg.

How can a rider make an administrative error of such magnitude that ALL of his points to that date would be erased/expunged. Basically, what I understand you to say is, if a rider in a sleep-need state makes such an error, it is at the discretion and authority of some person to remove all of that rider's efforts up to that point. And there is no arbiter? I would understand removing the points for that "leg", but all of his collective points were zeroed. If that's the case, I guess I'm not cut out to be a rally-guy as I don't do "kissy-face" real well.

 

[skyway]

'Tis a sad commentary on the passion we share and the "sport" of Iron Butt riding. From the comments of those who knew and rode with him and the pieces shared about his wife's outlook, I think I'm less a person for not knowing "Uncle Bud". RIP, sir.
What happened to SkooterG. He had a tremendous total of points and then he had "zero"...to end up with 93K. I am opining here, since I am not a member and have never ridden in a rally....but if he did something "horrendous" (A major infraction of the rules) he should have be asked to quit (meaning: tossed out on his derriere ), no? And if there was a minor infraction, should he have lost the points he was going for? It looks like he lost upwards of 100K + points on the 2nd day. It seems the man was well on his way to winning another rally this year, then "poof": nada, zilch, zero, nyet, nuthin'. Can someone who knows the rules the IBA guys play by fill in the gaps? One would assume there is some discretion used and the standard is the same for everyone riding the rally. Are the "penalties" proscribed in such a manner that everyone knows? Is there some sort of umpire or referee to conference with? Is it the sole discretion of one person? Are penalties meted out in an arbitrary or ambiguous way? The silence is deafening.

I'm prolly stirring up the mud puddle but honestly, as an innocent bystander who is curious. I'd really like to know before I consider taking the path to "the dark side".

Edit: Is there some unwritten code or rule that says one "Thou shalt not ask stupid or probing questions?" If there is, I guess its too late for me.

To sum up what MM2 is trying to convey, I think.

It is without a doubt that the FJR has stirred up a lot of interest among the community here in terms of LD riding. With that in mind there are many riders like MM2 who are getting ready to dip their toes in the water to see how it feels to go out and blaze the trails for 24hrs or more.

That said, after completing the entry SS1K ride into the IBA, it is obvious that enquiring minds are trying to find out what is going on at rallies, in an attempt to determine whether or not they want to pursue the time and energy that is required to participate in such events.

When an admin from this forum goes from virtual rally leader to zero points for the entire first leg, without a clear explanation from any of the powers that be (rally staff) IMO does not cast a bright light over a riding pastime commonly discussed in great detail on this forum.

 

[madmike2]

When an admin from this forum goes from virtual rally leader to zero points for the entire first leg, without a clear explanation from any of the powers that be (rally staff) IMO does not cast a bright light over a riding pastime commonly discussed in great detail on this forum.

Well....yeah. You know I have a "trip" planned, and I've been looking at the different rallies with rather wistful eyes lately. At WFO the FJR community was informed of the position the FJR is beginning to hold in the IBA presentations and those who ride them in such are held up (rightfully so) to high regard. I suppose I need more information and that's what I'm seeking.

Perhaps those who run the organizational side of the events are not aware that many watch from the sidelines with great interest but don't understand the "why's" of what takes place.

 

[Fabone]

Well....yeah. You know I have a "trip" planned, and I've been looking at the different rallies with rather wistful eyes lately. At WFO the FJR community was informed of the position the FJR is beginning to hold in the IBA presentations and those who ride them in such are held up (rightfully so) to high regard. I suppose I need more information and that's what I'm seeking.
Perhaps those who run the organizational side of the events are not aware that many watch from the sidelines with great interest but don't understand the "why's" of what takes place.

+1

Was thinking along the same lines. Had considered the Spank but timing was not right, thought then maybe next time. After following this I'm thinking, naw I don't think so. <_<

 

[Groo]

Guys, guys... give them a few days... I'm sure Skooter or Beeroux will explain what happened...

 

[twowheelnut]

Believe it or not, I feel we should let this item slide. Really. With Bud's passing and obvious ripples in our community, I might suggest that we let this go. When and if the truth comes to light will be in the hands of the participants. They need to work **** out, solely and communally. I say, we give 'em space to do that.

Much respect to all,

Tim

 

[HIGHLANDER]

Spank results are in.

https://www.spankrally.com/spank/DailyReports/Finish.html

the following were all on

FJRs (9 out of 23 starters):

2nd- Tobie & Lisa Stevens (tie)

5th- Art Montoya

6th- Doug Chapman

7th- Eric V.

9th- Matt Watkins

13th- Greg Marbach

16th- Al Lander

19th- Joseph Antolick

Must have been a tough year for everyone..

RIP Uncle Bud

 

[Jkern1]

When an admin from this forum goes from virtual rally leader to zero points for the entire first leg, without a clear explanation from any of the powers that be (rally staff) IMO does not cast a bright light over a riding pastime commonly discussed in great detail on this forum.

Well....yeah. You know I have a "trip" planned, and I've been looking at the different rallies with rather wistful eyes lately. At WFO the FJR community was informed of the position the FJR is beginning to hold in the IBA presentations and those who ride them in such are held up (rightfully so) to high regard. I suppose I need more information and that's what I'm seeking.

Perhaps those who run the organizational side of the events are not aware that many watch from the sidelines with great interest but don't understand the "why's" of what takes place.

First and foremost the standings of this rally and any other rally does not matter in the whole scene of life and riding in general. If you ask most of the participants they would say that having a safe and fun rally is much more important than where they finish. Also the rally staff does not care about the spectator point of view or opinions. Personally knowing the rally staff I’m sure that all actions where done in a fair manner. Also people need to realize the effort it takes to put on a rally, and the liability that the rallymaster takes on.

With that said who could someone loose all the points in one leg. If the paper works was not filed out or completed properly would be one scenario. Also they may have not done exactly what the instructions told him to do. Some time of time issue. There are multiple things in rally that could make you loose all your points. One thing you realize is that a rally is not just about getting the bonus, but reading and understanding exactly what the rallymaster wants. Their have been many rallies where I have lost point because I did read the instructions right.

Guys rallies are a fun way to go out and see the world, but remember you only get a plaque for winning.

 

[Colin24]

What happened to SkooterG. He had a tremendous total of points and then he had "zero"...to end up with 93K. ......

Are penalties meted out in an arbitrary or ambiguous way?

First off let me state I have never run one of these rallies myself, but plan to as soon as the planets align appropriately for my schedule. I've done an SS1K and submitted the paperwork some months back and I am patiently awaiting its arrival.

To answer your question.

A- Wait till SkooterG gets back and I am sure he will let us know.

B- No they are not meted out in an arbitrary or ambiguous way.

I would suggest you read up on the rally reports from the IBR, spank and Butt Lite rallies. (As well as any others you can find). Reading Comprehension is Key! And I make this as a comment directed to you and as a comment on why people in rallies lose points.

While I have no idea what the specifics of the SkooterG situation is, I can mention a couple things right off the top of my head that can take a competetor from first to last.

- Switching bikes in the grandaddy Iron Butt Rally is something like 10,000 point deduction. (It now seems to be considered a sport to watch riders in the IBR who have had to do this to desperately continue in the hopes of having a score that is just above zero!)

- Sitting down at the scoring table and leaving your paperwork on the bike. (This happened just this year in the ButtLight if I am not mistaken)

- Using a replacement towel. (Read up on the s--t that hit the fan after this one in the IBR some years back!)

I highly recomend you peruse the IBR reports from all the past IBR rallies as well as reports from the recently run Butt Lite and the Spank rally itself.

I was going to include links to specific write-ups of each of the aforementioned items. But I figure if your really interested, you can wade through all the writeups yourself. Because if you are interested in getting into this game, a little research can go a long way. So here are some top-level links, you'll have to dig to find the specific examples.

Iron Butt Rally

Spank Daily Reports

Team Strange Butt Lite 4

Is there some unwritten code or rule that says one "Thou shalt not ask stupid or probing questions?" If there is, I guess its too late for me.

The comment that was here has been removed. It was meant only as a statement of a personal opinion. Unfortunately several people have misinterpreted my comments as a personal attack on them or others. This was simply not the case. If you felt slighted by my comments then you have my apologies.

 

[tel]

I think Madmike's questions are ok. I did the first Spank Rally, one of the requirements was to call the Rallymaster between 7pm and 9pm, the second line of the instructions read that you HAD to actually speak to the Rallymaster, don't just leave a message. I didn't read that part and when I called back after 9pm George told me of my mistake and I was a DNF.

I was only mad with one person and that was me and couldn't wait for the next rally to prove to myself that I wasn't a numbskull.

I had a top 20 finish in the Utah 1088 and I'm looking forward to LOE. These rallys are competitiive and if it was easy to get a finish or be in the top 10 or so then they wouldn't be so rewarding. I truly admire the really top guys, they are a special bunch and also great people.

You can't change the rules because it doesn't seem fair after the event. We all get the same paperwork. Whenever I've called in to the Rallymaster during a rally they have been incredibly helpful, they are not trying to trick the riders but they expect you to read the paperwork. You can ask whatever questions you like, Jim Owen asked his fair share in Utah and won the rally.

Give it a go Mike I know having met you that you'll do well. Hope to see some of you guys in New Mexico in October.

tel

 

[Feejer/Weejer man]

hey "no patience", I was taught there are no stupid questions. Plus this is a site for conversation and a quest for knowledge. The only thing stupid about this is your response about stupid questions like you never asked a question in your life. I learned a long time ago that you can learn more faster by asking questions from the right people or sources. This site is one source I know of that I can get a correct answer or varying opinions.

 

[Bounce]

Switching bikes in the grandaddy Iron Butt Rally is something like 10,000 point deduction. (It now seems to be considered a sport to watch riders in the IBR who have had to do this to desperately continue in the hopes of having a score that is just above zero!)

Under the old rules, it used to be a 10,000 point penalty for swapping bikes (each time if more than once). In 2005 the rule changed to half your score (up to that point or for the whole rally, i don't remember).

There's no "sport" in watching someone claw there way back up to zero. There's admiration for those who, in the face of extreme adversity, choose to continue their rally, overcome the adversity, and be a finisher. How many people do you know that would continue to ride a grueling 1, 2 or 3 leg remainder when faced with such psycological baggage?

 

[weekend rider]

Either state the facts as to why he was "dqd" or make this a pointless thread and delete it.

All the comments are pure speculation and nothing more. It is sad that the person that 86'D him does not state the facts as to why he had to dq him.

All the comments made remind me of a bunch of old women standing around and gossiping about nothing, or a bunch of old men doing the same

Either tell the reason or get rid of the thread it is pointless................ :angry2:

weekend rider

 

[Woodstock]

To be clear, Skooter wasn't DQ'd or DNF'd, he not only finished, he finished #13.

The question we all noticed was that he was leading with the Leg1 provisional results, then the official results came out, and he had 0 pts. Looks like Skooter continued and did very well on Leg2. Hell, maybe there was an "all accumulated points" peanality for the leader after leg1.

 

[Bounce]

Someone seems to have pissed in WR's Post Toasties today. Also, his confusion about the difference between lost points and DQ's seems to imply a lack of clarity about endurance rallying. Usually the RM says nothing about the whys and wherefores. That's left AS AN OPTION to the affected rider.

The rider, the scorer, and the RM all understood the reasons as explained at the time. The rider and the scorer may not agree with the RM's final decision (or they may) but that doesn't matter, since all rallies have 2 basic rules.

1. No whining

2. The RM is always right (and, by extension, their decisions are final)

All other rules reference back to these 2 basics.

 

[madmike2]

The rider, the scorer, and the RM all understood the reasons as explained at the time. The rider and the scorer may not agree with the RM's final decision (or they may) but that doesn't matter, since all rallies have 2 basic rules.
1. No whining

2. The RM is always right (and, by extension, their decisions are final)

All other rules reference back to these 2 basics.

Thanks, Bounce. At least that explanation can be easily understood. We "side-liners" will never have an answer.

I highly recomend you peruse the IBR reports from all the past IBR rallies as well as reports from the recently run Butt Lite and the Spank rally itself.______________________________________

As such I personally have no patience for these "stupid" questions. And if I was ever acting as a "Rallymaster" then yes, that would be a rules infraction! Seriously, go start reading up.

1.) I have read the reports because I am/was interested. Therein lies the seed of my questions.

2.) By your answer/definition I may have, or already have, broken an unwritten rule?

 

[Bounce]

One example:

This rider collected receipts from every Wafflehouse that he saw (45 Wafflehouses total). When he got to the table he found that the Butt Lite bonus only said ONE receipt. All the others were a waste of his time and effort.

Reading comprehension, folk!