Rear shock linkage maintenance

[FJReady]

Yama,

You're almost there: You don't have to remove the left side C-stand bracket or bolts; remove the pivot bolt that the center stand pivots on. On the right side, go up there with a cutoff wheel (I think I used a Sawzall) and lop off that head. The one in your second photo. Its a pain in the *** but you only have to do it once. I think it helps if you remove the C-stand from its pivots for this.

Go to the hardware store and buy a couple 10mm bolts and nuts. (I forget the length but you can measure) Insert the new bolts from the inside. The nuts will be very close to the right exhaust pipe.

I was able to do this without knowing the exhaust flexing trick. Should be even easier with that option.

Good Luck..

 

[FJReady]

This job has turned into a clusterfuk of Bust's proportions.

The new Gold Standard, against which all clusterfucks will be forevermore compared. Thanks!

 

[odot]

I think I'm going to find some impossible bolt to remove so I can say I did some mx on my skoot.

 

[yamafitter]

I think I'm going to find some impossible bolt to remove so I can say I did some mx on my skoot.

Try removing the camshaft bearing caps without removing the valve cover. That should be just about impossible.

 

[Bustanut joker]

Why not cut them off as many have done and replace with new bolts?

I'm going to look at that option today and see if I can get my high-speed die grinder with a cutoff wheel in at the bolt heads.

Just remember to keep your fingers clear of the whirling disk of death.. I don't want to hear of you doing an Andy.

 

[yamafitter]

I finally got the relay arm out ....

All without flexing the exhaust or pulling an Andy and maiming myself for life. The more I thought about it the more it seemed Skooter's idea was going to be the path of least resistance and along with others suggestions I only cut the bolt for the righthand side. I checked if my die grinder cutoff wheel would work but I didn't have the clearance required so I had to resort to my sawzall which made short work of the offending bolt.

I was then able to move the bolt far enough over to the right to remove the relay arm. Then with a little penetrating oil on the collar I was able to use the bolt and nut to press out the collar. With the collar out the bolt was then very easy to remove completely.

The collars in the relay arm for both the shock mount and the pivot arms show sight wear but do not need replacing at this time. The parts are currently soaking in my parts cleaning tank and some new parts are on order.

The sun is shining again but at -15oC the birds are not singing yet. I've been invited over to a buddy's place this afternoon to drink his beer so all is now good in the world again.

 

[Fred W]

Good work Billy!

Yes, this is probably the worst PITA job we have to endure in performing regular maintenance on our FJRs. What a consummate ****-up by Yamaha designing a suspension pivot that can't be removed without removing the center-stand, and then designing a center stand that can't be removed easily without removing the exhaust header (on 2nd & 3rd gens. The superior 1st gens come equipped with convenient flexi-headers).

All this work for what? To lube that one damn upper frame pivot. Grrrr!!!

Enjoy the brewskies, man... now that you've actually earned them.

 

[Canadian FJR]

Are you folks using loctite on the relay arm bolts when it comes time to put everything back together. I simply torqued everything up properly and then used a dab of Goop on the end of the nut. I'm wondering if I should have used loctite.

Canadian FJR

 

[Fred W]

Valid question, Scott.

My feeling is that the self locking nuts will keep things properly assembled between service intervals, as long as they are in decent shape.

The problem lies in the interpretation of my last clause. Some folks say that all self locking nuts should be replaced per use. I'm a cheap bastid and reuse them willy nilly. So, while I've never been burned by that in all of my years prior, that's not to say that I can condone such reckless disregard by others. (IOW, YMMV)

Here's my lame, backyard mechanic's justification: These suspension pivot bolts bolts are not particularly torque sensitive, IMO. They are merely there to hold the parts together that do the real support in their proper places (bearing inner and bearings). The reason that the torque values are so low is that they are not really performing any particular function by squeezing these parts together in a clamping action, but rather just to hold the parts reasonably tight so there are no gaps in the bearing parts. In no case is the weight of the suspension borne on the bolt cross section, unless the whole affair has failed or come very loose. The locknuts should prevent the very loose condition.

All of that said... blue locktite probably wouldn't cause any problems. It seldom does. Red might be different. But I'd prefer that you understood the situation before goobering a bunch of it on there.

 

[SkooterG]

I've never used loctite. Never had an issue with a bolt loosening over time and miles. Not at all needed imho.

 

[Auburn]

I use the red Honda locktite, but in the case of these, I just torqued them to the spec. It is a self locking nut already.

 

[yamafitter]

Here's my lame, backyard mechanic's justification: .... In no case is the weight of the suspension borne on the bolt cross section, unless the whole affair has failed or come very loose. The locknuts should prevent the very loose condition....

I'm not sure I am understanding what you are saying here. For example the rear suspension load applies a shearing force to the bolts holding the relay arm in place. Very little if any tension forces are being applied to these bolts other then the torque being applied by the tightness of the locking nuts. Does this not mean that the suspension force is being applied across the cross section of the bolt rather than radially or in tension along the bolt? Just wondering.

 

[Fred W]

Here's my lame, backyard mechanic's justification: .... In no case is the weight of the suspension borne on the bolt cross section, unless the whole affair has failed or come very loose. The locknuts should prevent the very loose condition....

I'm not sure I am understanding what you are saying here. For example the rear suspension load applies a shearing force to the bolts holding the relay arm in place. Very little if any tension forces are being applied to these bolts other then the torque being applied by the tightness of the locking nuts. Does this not mean that the suspension force is being applied across the cross section of the bolt rather than radially or in tension along the bolt? Just wondering.

Yeah, you are exactly right. That bit about the bolt "cross section" is worded completely wrong.

The weight is being borne by the cross section of the bolt, whether loose or tight, not by any axial clamping forces of the fastener. That is what I meant to convey. Just got tripped up a little bit on my own words. (it happens sometimes after happy hour)

 

[petey]

Here's my lame, backyard mechanic's justification: .... In no case is the weight of the suspension borne on the bolt cross section, unless the whole affair has failed or come very loose. The locknuts should prevent the very loose condition....

I'm not sure I am understanding what you are saying here. For example the rear suspension load applies a shearing force to the bolts holding the relay arm in place. Very little if any tension forces are being applied to these bolts other then the torque being applied by the tightness of the locking nuts. Does this not mean that the suspension force is being applied across the cross section of the bolt rather than radially or in tension along the bolt? Just wondering.

Yeah, you are exactly right. That bit about the bolt "cross section" is worded completely wrong.

The weight is being borne by the cross section of the bolt, whether loose or tight, not by any axial clamping forces of the fastener. That is what I meant to convey. Just got tripped up a little bit on my own words. (it happens sometimes after happy hour)

T'was clear as mud to me...

(even after happy hour)

 

[yamafitter]

Just when I thought I might be out of the woods and making progress.....

I pulled the relay arm out of the cleaning tank and was using some compressed air to dry everything. The next thing I know there are needle bearings flying everywhere in my garage. For those that have seen my garage you will know that the odds of finding all the needle bearings are less than you being hit in the head by an meteorite in the next 5 minutes. For those who have not seen my garage, this is what is looks like when I have things organized.....

Since I'm now at this stage I will just order all new bearings, collars and seals for the relay arm and completely rebuild it.

One small step forward, multiple giant leaps backwards. As Bust would say, "FUZZY BALLS!!!!".

 

[BigOgre]

Nvm.

 

[Chiefblueman]

I think I see one under the snowblower

 

[Panman]

Just when I thought I might be out of the woods and making progress.....
I pulled the relay arm out of the cleaning tank and was using some compressed air to dry everything. The next thing I know there are needle bearings flying everywhere in my garage. For those that have seen my garage you will know that the odds of finding all the needle bearings are less than you being hit in the head by an meteorite in the next 5 minutes. For those who have not seen my garage, this is what is looks like when I have things organized.....

Since I'm now at this stage I will just order all new bearings, collars and seals for the relay arm and completely rebuild it.

One small step forward, multiple giant leaps backwards. As Bust would say, "FUZZY BALLS!!!!".

That's kinda like me and flexing.

 

[LAF]

At the risk of repeating myself many times over. These in no shape, way, or form, at least to me, are a bearing. These are bushings. From when I first read this forum and have seen pictures of this part, and hear experiences as you have just had only confirm that.

When I put the Pensky on at 0 miles I said it then after only seeing the lower two links. Then again when I did my top link not too long ago.

That material in between those needle bearings is a hard "plastic" type material that wears where the insert goes through. I never tried to clean any of mine other then with a clean rag lots of new grease and cleaning it all up after getting the collar and bolt through. The two lower links are "worn" more then the top link but all three look ok to me after 24,000 or so. I did fine sand my collars as they showed a shiny spot here and there but nothing to sweat.

Also, from new, there is very little grease in any of the three links, at least in my 10!

I suspect that the parts cleaner got to this material whatever it is? I also suspect that with just fresh grease every 25,000 or so these will go a long way.

The design is so simple, as the collar is "pressed" into the needles, that material and grease fill that area between needles and "float" that collar. Those needles do not turn.

I know some have never touched them in a bunch of miles and no issues. I will do mine on the Valve schedule.

They are a PITA to do but as I said I think we bring some of this stuff on ourselves. I would love to hear others ideas at to what you think the "plastic" is? I have seen it described as a hard plastic? It looks and wears more like some type of hard grease or lubricant.

 

[Fred W]

It is definitely NOT a hard plastic. Soft plastic, perhaps. Mine just fell apart when I picked at it lightly. It is clear that they are not important to the function of the bearing (or bushing). My guess is that this plasticky stuff is just there to contain the needles inside the bearing until the bearing has been pressed into the Relay Arm and the center collar/race/spacer/bushing can be inserted. Once inserted those needles aren't going anywhere

As to whether it is a bearing or a bushing, I think it is just a matter of semantics. In the Yamaha parts breakdown the outer race and needles that gets pressed into the arm is called BEARING 93315-31759-00 and the center sleeve is called COLLAR 90387-102R4-00 and COLLAR 90387-127W0-00.